From nobody Sun Jul 7 18:03:36 2024 X-Original-To: freebsd-arm@mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4WHFVt23Vlz5QCCZ for ; Sun, 07 Jul 2024 18:03:50 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from wlosh@bsdimp.com) Received: from mail-pg1-x535.google.com (mail-pg1-x535.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::535]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 (128/128 bits) key-exchange X25519 server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) server-digest SHA256 client-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits) client-digest SHA256) (Client CN "smtp.gmail.com", Issuer "WR4" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 4WHFVt1MSCz413P for ; Sun, 7 Jul 2024 18:03:50 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from wlosh@bsdimp.com) Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; none Received: by mail-pg1-x535.google.com with SMTP id 41be03b00d2f7-7611b6a617cso1739446a12.3 for ; Sun, 07 Jul 2024 11:03:50 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=bsdimp-com.20230601.gappssmtp.com; s=20230601; t=1720375429; x=1720980229; darn=freebsd.org; h=cc:to:subject:message-id:date:from:in-reply-to:references :mime-version:from:to:cc:subject:date:message-id:reply-to; bh=ceY+82PzaZ8zPVK5y5qkHdEFaiLKqz8A3Egk+xEOBb0=; b=tJohjnG4TIgbOyYZc0grRVRVPgKMgQqjlN53rgG36764cj+a5DNROLxJG1edT0kLVn lItlQIg5PtQf7rt7o19RAb62WuLr2Zp4MxyJv7XtK1qcecmLl0JuSCUk994FtXLki7vd xivE1F5CU1ly7NDNb6W9Cv+0UJGyNu4k+Ossmj+ZFmgXT4XOICua49Y8G7qXSe80Fa+H /08FQz8l4PkitqIFfvTDYj6FpH8qOYmb3v8ymFavvsS382Q7QpCamzDsVBqRkCv0IRw7 yvEEjsT6LWakhpnfoaCFlpOQFyK26cZ7R4lsr4iLkDdRvKP1Wj+RiME9gnGeiUraji3N ShVw== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20230601; t=1720375429; x=1720980229; h=cc:to:subject:message-id:date:from:in-reply-to:references :mime-version:x-gm-message-state:from:to:cc:subject:date:message-id :reply-to; bh=ceY+82PzaZ8zPVK5y5qkHdEFaiLKqz8A3Egk+xEOBb0=; b=STwM+JfLh2IiB5nnnDHllyDO/Av+YIsKejWIlNyx2rG8ficlGnYKgiA+hOOPMFabCw iX2S74NNB81mKLUNPbsHjQQQymEpYvJ00Z2yae/1KhErwb7+A+2U45nEpXADAgLEeA1j kSfAimsoCabcqynUx+gx6x4wk56xCk3BsADJmon8/8fgeoSUwTZ1v694p05JnAVqiGBN FsE2Za0LZmDiq9Sh6nE4QWpfg/oVPDSKbcc/K8rXrQ/cieiO247KFKqOa4UatIMyF/ni XeBOxxu66vz5lLUiqP95T5Ukzw+5j42nwUIndIGc2WUlx2o0dsY9ZHSBFNC0HY01qe2K tw1g== X-Forwarded-Encrypted: i=1; AJvYcCWT82OlHbeY56CtytnAPs6GrTEoaP9qSdnhrHp5UgK7e5cdFFxJiB7WAj2Aqg+8IPs1iopX0LqTcROgZatHZu3GSljLthJoTQ== X-Gm-Message-State: AOJu0Yw8NjZJQ72Yr7aC/4CJmD7eywr5gyfX7nJ27laWvw2PwZqlsjWy PyoxcFt4QPcb658uLh9f83qt0Ugg9Ohqc/g9mAxNAWwE1tj9R63Ok4YvCuXGr8+xQKsROlDPINZ DnegArJ48le0VZpO6XI7WB1QCOnSS9FsRFZvQSw== X-Google-Smtp-Source: AGHT+IGIPDdesDr46l1KeAfIZNsF/ROdBVzWOTqZGCuXdmsLSpIbXNlPHSM4zZCt7FOY+vMs9Y3tQmyrsbHPHemhxmg= X-Received: by 2002:a17:90a:eb05:b0:2c9:888a:7a7b with SMTP id 98e67ed59e1d1-2c99c570392mr5347373a91.25.1720375428642; Sun, 07 Jul 2024 11:03:48 -0700 (PDT) List-Id: Porting FreeBSD to ARM processors List-Archive: https://lists.freebsd.org/archives/freebsd-arm List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: Sender: owner-freebsd-arm@FreeBSD.org MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <454282477.15929.1720372600841@localhost> <3C703965-FE57-441D-9A64-0EB72C7E7E6F@yahoo.com> In-Reply-To: <3C703965-FE57-441D-9A64-0EB72C7E7E6F@yahoo.com> From: Warner Losh Date: Sun, 7 Jul 2024 12:03:36 -0600 Message-ID: Subject: Re: ntpd vs ntpdate with no hardware clock To: Mark Millard Cc: bob prohaska , Ronald Klop , "freebsd-arm@freebsd.org" Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="0000000000004e14cb061cac1e26" X-Spamd-Bar: ---- X-Rspamd-Pre-Result: action=no action; module=replies; Message is reply to one we originated X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-4.00 / 15.00]; REPLY(-4.00)[]; ASN(0.00)[asn:15169, ipnet:2607:f8b0::/32, country:US] X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 4WHFVt1MSCz413P --0000000000004e14cb061cac1e26 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On Sun, Jul 7, 2024, 11:54=E2=80=AFAM Mark Millard wrot= e: > On Jul 7, 2024, at 10:23, bob prohaska wrote: > > > On Sun, Jul 07, 2024 at 11:18:56AM -0600, Warner Losh wrote: > >> On Sun, Jul 7, 2024, 11:16=E2=80=AFAM Ronald Klop wrote: > >> > >>> I created fakertc for my rpi4. > >>> > >>> https://www.freshports.org/sysutils/fakertc/ > >>> > >>> Saves the time on shutdown and sets it back early at boot. > >>> > >>> Plus I use ntpdate together with ntpd. Works fine. > >>> > >> > >> Curious why the root mod time isn't firing... it whould alrwady do tha= t > >> > > Root mod time seems fairly laggy: > > rprohask@www:~ % date > > Sun Jul 7 10:20:38 PDT 2024 > > rprohask@www:~ % ls -al / > > total 97 > > drwxr-xr-x 20 root wheel 512 Jul 5 13:21 . > > drwxr-xr-x 20 root wheel 512 Jul 5 13:21 .. > > unless I'm misusing ls -al, of course.... > > I mount with noatime in use. Do you? > Doesn't matter since it's in the superblock. Are you trying to show: > > time when file was created (-Ul) > time when file status was last changed (-cl) > time when file was last modified (-l) > time of last access (-ul) > > You implicitly specified "last modified". So > when was the last change to the root directory > representation? It likely is not modified often. > (Modifications to file content and subdirectories > would not modify / of itself.) > It's in the superblock. Time of last unmount / update (I'd recalled incorrectly). linux can have relatime vs. strictatime modes. > relatime mode updates the atime less often, via > a rule set. A linux can have relatime by default. > Yea... none of that matters... Warner =3D=3D=3D > Mark Millard > marklmi at yahoo.com > > --0000000000004e14cb061cac1e26 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable


On Sun, Jul 7, 2024, 11:54=E2=80=AFAM Mark Millard <= ;marklmi@yahoo.com> wrote:
<= /div>
On Jul 7, 2024, at 10:23, bob prohaska = <fbsd@www.zefox.net> wrote:

> On Sun, Jul 07, 2024 at 11:18:56AM -0600, Warner Losh wrote:
>> On Sun, Jul 7, 2024, 11:16=E2=80=AFAM Ronald Klop <ronald-lis= ts@klop.ws> wrote:
>>
>>> I created fakertc for my rpi4.
>>>
>>> https://www.freshports.org/sys= utils/fakertc/
>>>
>>> Saves the time on shutdown and sets it back early at boot.
>>>
>>> Plus I use ntpdate together with ntpd. Works fine.
>>>
>>
>> Curious why the root mod time isn't firing... it whould alrwad= y do that
>>
> Root mod time seems fairly laggy:
> rprohask@www:~ % date
> Sun Jul=C2=A0 7 10:20:38 PDT 2024
> rprohask@www:~ % ls -al /
> total 97
> drwxr-xr-x=C2=A0 20 root wheel=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0512 Jul=C2=A0 5 13:2= 1 .
> drwxr-xr-x=C2=A0 20 root wheel=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0512 Jul=C2=A0 5 13:2= 1 ..
> unless I'm misusing ls -al, of course....

I mount with noatime in use. Do you?

Doesn't matter since it's in = the superblock.

Are you trying to show:

time when file was created (-Ul)
time when file status was last changed (-cl)
time when file was last modified (-l)
time of last access (-ul)

You implicitly specified "last modified". So
when was the last change to the root directory
representation? It likely is not modified often.
(Modifications to file content and subdirectories
would not modify / of itself.)

It's in the superblock. Time of last unmo= unt / update (I'd recalled incorrectly).

linux can have relatime vs. strictatime modes.
relatime mode updates the atime less often, via
a rule set. A linux can have relatime by default.

Yea... none of that matter= s...

Warner

=3D=3D=3D
Mark Millard
marklmi at yahoo.com

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