From owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Tue Jun 7 22:34:51 2005 Return-Path: <owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG> X-Original-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6A07C16A41C for <freebsd-chat@freebsd.org>; Tue, 7 Jun 2005 22:34:51 +0000 (GMT) (envelope-from ronald-freebsd8@klop.yi.org) Received: from smtp-out2.tiscali.nl (smtp-out2.tiscali.nl [195.241.79.177]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id AEB8C43D49 for <freebsd-chat@freebsd.org>; Tue, 7 Jun 2005 22:34:50 +0000 (GMT) (envelope-from ronald-freebsd8@klop.yi.org) Received: from guido.klop.ws (unknown [82.171.39.195]) by smtp-out2.tiscali.nl (Postfix) with SMTP id A62EDB000091 for <freebsd-chat@freebsd.org>; Wed, 8 Jun 2005 00:34:44 +0200 (CEST) Received: (qmail 4434 invoked from network); 7 Jun 2005 22:34:44 -0000 Received: from localhost (HELO outgoing.local) (127.0.0.1) by localhost with SMTP; 7 Jun 2005 22:34:44 -0000 To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org, freebsd-stable@freebsd.org References: <200506061548.j56FmQ7w026456@lurza.secnetix.de> Message-ID: <op.sr0ub4o18527sy@outgoing.local> Date: Wed, 08 Jun 2005 00:34:42 +0200 From: "Ronald Klop" <ronald-freebsd8@klop.yi.org> Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; delsp=yes; charset=iso-8859-1 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit In-Reply-To: <200506061548.j56FmQ7w026456@lurza.secnetix.de> User-Agent: Opera M2/8.0 (FreeBSD, build 1095) Cc: Subject: Re: filesystems not properly unmounted [OT] X-BeenThere: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Non technical items related to the community <freebsd-chat.freebsd.org> List-Unsubscribe: <http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-chat>, <mailto:freebsd-chat-request@freebsd.org?subject=unsubscribe> List-Archive: <http://lists.freebsd.org/pipermail/freebsd-chat> List-Post: <mailto:freebsd-chat@freebsd.org> List-Help: <mailto:freebsd-chat-request@freebsd.org?subject=help> List-Subscribe: <http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-chat>, <mailto:freebsd-chat-request@freebsd.org?subject=subscribe> X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 07 Jun 2005 22:34:51 -0000 Did you guys already unmount your filesystem? On Mon, 06 Jun 2005 17:48:26 +0200, Oliver Fromme <olli@lurza.secnetix.de> wrote: > Yuval Levy <yuval_levy@yahoo.com> wrote: > > Oliver Fromme wrote: > > > I do look carefully every day, because it's my job. I work > > > with various operating systems every day, including FreeBSD > > > and Linux. > > > > From a professional I would expect a more mature and balanced > approach, > > rather than "my favorite OS is the best one and the others have no > > advantages". > > That's not what I wrote. FreeBSD is not "the best". There > is no such thing as "the best", in general. > > > Be real: there is a lot of diversity of OS out there and > > they all have advantages and disadvantages. > > Right. Everyone has to decide for himself which tool works > best for his job. > > > > Yup, I know the usual freebsd-for-servers and linux-for- > > > desktops arguments. And to be honest, I'm fed up with > > > them. They're lies. I'm running FreeBSD on my desktop > > > at home, a lot of people are happily running Linux on > > > their servers, and I've seen people successfully installing > > > FreeBSD who have never even heard the word "unix" until > > > that day. > > > > You can run FreeBSD on your desktop at home because you have the > skills, > > the time, the dedication. > > For most "standard" applications it doesn't require any > more skills (or time, or dedication) than with any other > OS. In fact, getting some applications to work correctly > under, say, Windows requires more skills (and time, and > dedication) sometimes. > > > You are special. Every human being is special > > Right. I don't disagree with you there. > > > [...] They do not share your view. > > I do not share your view. This does not make us liars. > > Uhm, what are you talking about? I've never called you a > liar. But those people who claim that FreeBSD is only > suitable for servers and Linux is only suitable for desk- > tops -- those are liars. There are plenty of counter- > examples. > > > I am moving my servers from Linux to FreeBSD, because FreeBSD gives me > > the manageability, stability and security that are more important to > my > > clients than the bleeding edge features that often make it into Linux > first. > > > > I am generally inclined toward Open Source software over proprietary > > one, but will pragmatically mix and match to obtain what works best > for > > me rather than dogmatically pretend that my favorite OS is the best > and > > its filesystem is the brightest and its license is the only acceptable > > distribution form. > > I agree 100%. > > Most of "my" machines (i.e. the machines which I own or > which I'm responsible for to operate) run FreeBSD, but some > also run Linux (Debian), Solaris or Windows. I used to > have OpenBSD, too, but it stopped working for me (a long > story). And currently I'm evaluating to move one of my > privat machines from FreeBSD to DragonFly BSD, because > some of its features would be very useful. > > Still, of all of those systems, FreeBSD is (currently) my > favourite. It's particularly versatile to work well for > all kinds of different purposes, including servers _and_ > desktops. > > > Which brings me back to the topic of this thread: is there anybody out > > there with the skills to cleanly solve this shameful situation in > which > > rebooting FreeBSD results in unclean mounting of ext2 (and potentially > > other) volumes? > > A umount command in rc.shutdown should be a feasible > work-around. > > Fixing the driver is probably not a high-priority, because > not many users are affected by the problem, I guess. > (But then again: It's open source, so you can try to fix > it yourself.) > > Best regards > Oliver > > PS: I think this should rather move to the -chat list. > -- Ronald Klop Amsterdam, The Netherlands