Date: Wed, 23 Jun 1999 08:48:11 +0930 From: Greg Lehey <grog@lemis.com> To: Mike Smith <mike@smith.net.au> Cc: hm@hcs.de, dfr@nlsystems.com, peter@FreeBSD.org, cvs-all@FreeBSD.org, FreeBSD Hackers <hackers@FreeBSD.org> Subject: Re: All this and documentation too? (was: cvs commit: src/sys/isa sio.c) Message-ID: <19990623084811.Q76907@freebie.lemis.com> In-Reply-To: <199906220842.BAA01553@dingo.cdrom.com>; from Mike Smith on Tue, Jun 22, 1999 at 01:42:05AM -0700 References: <19990622180252.J76907@freebie.lemis.com> <199906220842.BAA01553@dingo.cdrom.com>
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On Tuesday, 22 June 1999 at 1:42:05 -0700, Mike Smith wrote:
>> And they might, too. phk has frequently expressed a desire to either
>> write documentation on existing systems, or at least help others do
>> so.
>
> No offence meant, but we can see how much of this has actually
> materialised.
None taken. But if it hasn't happened yet, it's not phk's fault. The
real problem is a general attitude: UTSL. Sure, a good hacker can get
by with the source, but good documentation makes for a smoother
project.
>>> It has never happened that way (anywhere, on any project),
>>
>> Of course it has. It's just uncommon in the FreeBSD environment. In
>> many large projects, you don't do any code until you have a clear
>> definition of what you're going to do.
>
> It's uncommon in _most_ environments. Or perhaps tech writers exist
> for some other purpose?
I don't know too many UNIX tech writers.
>>> and it never will.
>>
>> My father never had a computer, and his father never did, so I never
>> will have one. What an argument.
>
> The circumstances aren't comparable.
Why not? In each case, you're resisting change.
>>> Documentation is written after the fact, by someone else.
>>
>> That's the worst kind of documentation. In fact, most UNIX
>> documentation is written by the authors. After the fact, admittedly.
>
> In fact, most Unix documentation is never written, being my original
> point.
That doesn't make it a desirable or unchangeable situation.
>> Hopefully the change of subject line and recipients will get some more
>> representative views on this subject.
>
> Perhaps I should have been clearer; the sort of documentation that the
> original set of plaintiffs were asking for is the mythical "describe
> everything as it was, is and will be, and make it constantly
> representative and up to date".
This clarifies your interpretation of the situation. In fact, I was
the "original plaintiff", and I wrote:
>> Nice to know there's a man page. But the real thing is that the
>> "right thing" to do needs to be documented somewhere. It would be
>> nice, for example, to have an overview of the design principles. Yes,
>> I know I'm asking for a lot here, but it would really help.
> These are the same people that will complain about disparities
> between any extant documentation and reality, as well as carp
> incessantly about the lack of some form of documentation other than
> what already exists ("why isn't there a permuted index?" "where's
> the sanskrit translation?"
I think you're reading more into this than was stated.
> "my cat can't read _this_!").
Put in a PR. cat should be able to read anything.
> As always, complaining about the _lack_ of something is the wrong
> approach for this project. Step up and fill the gap, or expose
> yourself to criticism for failing to do so. There has to be a way
> to make a verb from Brett Glass' name, but I'm sure you get the
> point.
"To glass"?
Yes, I'm a firm believer in "if it's broke, fix it yourself". I'm
also not complaining about the current situation; it's probably too
late for that. But it would be really nice if we could cultivate this
concept of describing what you're doing while you're doing it.
Greg
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