From owner-freebsd-advocacy Tue Aug 7 10:46:52 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org Received: from scaup.mail.pas.earthlink.net (scaup.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.121.49]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 939CE37B40D for ; Tue, 7 Aug 2001 10:46:48 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from tlambert2@mindspring.com) Received: from mindspring.com (dialup-209.244.105.118.Dial1.SanJose1.Level3.net [209.244.105.118]) by scaup.mail.pas.earthlink.net (EL-8_9_3_3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id KAA21142; Tue, 7 Aug 2001 10:46:15 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <3B702990.CC88CC62@mindspring.com> Date: Tue, 07 Aug 2001 10:46:56 -0700 From: Terry Lambert Reply-To: tlambert2@mindspring.com X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en]C-CCK-MCD {Sony} (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Jeremiah Gowdy Cc: Ted Mittelstaedt , j mckitrick , Wes Peters , freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: time to step up to the SMP plate? References: <002601c11f36$4b0b2080$1401a8c0@tedm.placo.com> <005001c11f4c$2409eb90$aa240018@cx443070b> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Jeremiah Gowdy wrote: > > This gives rise to some interesting permutations in the software. > > For example, everyone criticizes sysinstall and would love a GUI > > installer - but nobody can possibly justify the effort of throwing > > out a program that you basically use ONCE then toss aside. > > To isolate a single point, how can people be critical of sysinstall ? > Certainly from a text base 'GUI' standpoint, some things could be improved, > but jeez, look at OpenBSD and to a point NetBSD. At least NetBSD has some > nice little dialog boxes. OpenBSD's installer is a complete joke. A joke > that isn't funny. I've always wished they'd realize what the BSD license is > and just _take_ sysinstall and use it for their installer. The same with > the FreeBSD boot loader (ever try multi-booting OpenBSD ?). The point is, except for OEM loads, which Linux is pursuing, and FreeBSD has failed to pursue successfully, the first user experience is the installer. It is therefore the installer where one captures (or loses) mindshare: if someone can not load your code, without fear, then they will never try it. People (myself included, and, I think, Jordan, thruth be told) are critical of sysinstall because it is only comparatively better: pick a different product to compare to, like Windows ME Upgrade, and what "better" you could argue goes right out the window. The issue with the installer is one of editorial control, and permissable use of the trademark, more than anything else. I think the trademark issue was clarified sufficiently the last this discussion arose (finally!), so now it's just a matter of someone seeing some money in improving things, or someone taking the albatross about their neck, and doing the work for free. If no one beats me to it, I will eventually get around to dealing with the package registration of base system components, once the NetBSD rc system has been MFC'ed (or when -current becomes -stable). -- Terry To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message