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Date:      Wed, 22 Aug 2001 17:10:16 -0700
From:      "Bruce A. Mah" <bmah@FreeBSD.ORG>
To:        Leo Bicknell <bicknell@ufp.org>
Cc:        freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG
Subject:   Re: ssh password cracker - now this *is* cool! 
Message-ID:  <200108230010.f7N0AGf27563@intruder.bmah.org>
In-Reply-To: <20010822195508.B93930@ussenterprise.ufp.org> 
References:  <200108222330.f7MNUUj80882@earth.backplane.com> <20010822195508.B93930@ussenterprise.ufp.org>

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If memory serves me right, Leo Bicknell wrote:
> On Wed, Aug 22, 2001 at 04:30:30PM -0700, Matt Dillon wrote:
> > 	http://www.vnunet.com/News/1124839
> 
> Several people on other mailing lists have pointed out that Nagle
> should make this much harder, although it's unclear how Nagle and
> ssh interact.  So far that has resulted in a number of degenerating
> discussions of how things work.  Of course, Nagle will not help
> between two machines on the same ethernet segment, but probably
> would make the process described in the paper much harder.

Indeed.  They also didn't discuss (or I didn't see it) the effects of 
queueing or jitter in the network on their scheme.

This *is* pretty neat, although it is less of a password cracker 
than a scheme of narrowing down the space of possible passwords.

> All of this aruges for Kerberos or some other cryptographic system
> so once you're authenticated once there is little or no need to type
> additional passwords.

ssh-agent(1)/ssh-add(1) does all of its authentication locally, so my
extremely naive reading is that it'd be immune to this particular type
of attack, since human-typed passphrases never cross the network.

Bruce.



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