From owner-freebsd-isp@FreeBSD.ORG Wed Jan 11 14:41:39 2006 Return-Path: X-Original-To: freebsd-isp@freebsd.org Delivered-To: freebsd-isp@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8B54116A41F for ; Wed, 11 Jan 2006 14:41:39 +0000 (GMT) (envelope-from danial_thom@yahoo.com) Received: from web33310.mail.mud.yahoo.com (web33310.mail.mud.yahoo.com [68.142.206.125]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 24C3E43D46 for ; Wed, 11 Jan 2006 14:41:38 +0000 (GMT) (envelope-from danial_thom@yahoo.com) Received: (qmail 33130 invoked by uid 60001); 11 Jan 2006 14:41:37 -0000 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=yahoo.com; h=Message-ID:Received:Date:From:Reply-To:Subject:To:Cc:In-Reply-To:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding; b=gri2wJG5kNM6popX8rbu2m7+hEAFAQHiQwujdF6affSUArF6m2ZJ7Qdt2b47pcJZK8eivNo/cDZdtwiWoFj7H7kMRUVk61mVGW6w06ov/0pg+ssOE4Riijmfuf+TgI+chyJ/oOeiTzE6pBk82DbKqZVrkN7RpNX4GdKVujqe+W0= ; Message-ID: <20060111144137.33128.qmail@web33310.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Received: from [24.46.186.215] by web33310.mail.mud.yahoo.com via HTTP; Wed, 11 Jan 2006 06:41:37 PST Date: Wed, 11 Jan 2006 06:41:37 -0800 (PST) From: Danial Thom To: "Matthew D. Fuller" In-Reply-To: <20060111142106.GH98918@over-yonder.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Cc: freebsd-isp@freebsd.org, ann kok Subject: Re: freebsd router X-BeenThere: freebsd-isp@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: danial_thom@yahoo.com List-Id: Internet Services Providers List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 11 Jan 2006 14:41:39 -0000 --- "Matthew D. Fuller" wrote: > On Wed, Jan 11, 2006 at 06:10:15AM -0800 I > heard the voice of > Danial Thom, and lo! it spake thus: > > > > Well thats just stupid. Clearly I'm referring > to general purpose > > operating systems, not custom hardware > platforms. > > "[...] fastest router platform man has ever > created" doesn't include, > imply, or even allow such qualifications. > State insane hyperbole, > expect to get called on insane hyperbole 8-} > > > > And I don't see any of your logic for > thinking that "newer FreeBSD > > versions" are faster. They're not. > > Well, for starters, _I_ never expressed any > opinion as to whether they > were. 5.x certainly isn't (but then, 5.x is > slower at most things > than 4.x). 6.x may be, in certain situations. > And 7.x very likely > will be, particularly with the work Andre is > currently doing in the > network stack. MP is a DECIDED advantage in > routing since you can > process things in parallel, and routing is a > _very_ parallelizable > operation, since packets are independent of > each other. No, that's wrong. Firstly, you CAN do things in parallel, but when you chop up the "tasks" in routing you don't gain anything, in fact you lose, because it is best done as a single task. Think of it as a 100M dash with 1 guy against a relay team of 2 guys, with all 3 exactly the same speed. The 1 guy will win every time, because you'll never overcome the hand-off. The best you'll ever be able to do is tie him. By "threading" the kernel you make it run more efficiently when you have tasks that have to stop-and-wait for other things, but in a router your main, preemptive task is the routing, which you can't improve by parallelizing it. In fact you add lots of unnecessary cpu cycles that get in the way of the single task approach. You *might* be able to gain additional capacity IF you design the rx/tx tasks in a certain way, but you'll have more latency through the box. I can promise you that 7.0 is far from "probably" anything. They are a long way off. Maybe come up with some real benchmarks (like the one I suggested in my other post) so you won't be bamboozled by the hype so easily. DT __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com