From owner-svn-src-head@freebsd.org Thu Apr 9 23:42:11 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: svn-src-head@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D000D2AABCD for ; Thu, 9 Apr 2020 23:42:11 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from ian@freebsd.org) Received: from outbound2m.ore.mailhop.org (outbound2m.ore.mailhop.org [54.149.155.156]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits) server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits)) (Client did not present a certificate) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 48yyNg2kYBz4RKg for ; Thu, 9 Apr 2020 23:42:11 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from ian@freebsd.org) ARC-Seal: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; t=1586475729; cv=none; d=outbound.mailhop.org; s=arc-outbound20181012; b=jNgifBC3+3/nvGiEwQ0eYbHy1uiArhxh+XNVql8aevmsWoNacghiFIIyMBZMLC/SqpehQxktC4KuO jqAyuaQ+JiZmA6dmx7B9gdLCIGqk5ee9l2VkiB7o1E4x9WHarYKGUjcArMdJBIB8sgF7sYXEDsGigO eaGx5jSG8TFphqkIwfESMDYjc3Igpa+Axal46QTcgqC2reO43lSpelOTPlsYs9I1sHC+/Mcft0kYLB 5L8Xqrie8Au2wgi0fMrihBb+CFOyZ/cqrI/UTuCK+gaJRaNjCz97xZ0dhCBAa6IU3FHuGxKDOLmyf1 ujMWzAVmiVlv/ZqAUqFGU4SdHtO3P1w== ARC-Message-Signature: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=outbound.mailhop.org; s=arc-outbound20181012; h=content-transfer-encoding:mime-version:content-type:references:in-reply-to: date:cc:to:from:subject:message-id:dkim-signature:from; bh=X5ZQIbjd9VJTayqY1aSlDPS0b08971ktiC0E3clcIHs=; b=PsRLdWa8+ycpMrsbzcD70OG4LpO5Nhlm3GjcWzYsWfnF0577U8NuwtViPDPwMxzCw0Zq2SsHrJtDR 66cHioW4YOYJXgt7y6VF3yHmA6tIUaPfl3zxnFMSd3gSTK0zTTq70YLJseE/xEmC2M+aunRdQ0qMm8 zdD5hPUQ9na1Hz5bhKHfbRwMb4TSPI4GDkbsz2XAuj8sB12wWPqmT0VPEeYwxB/oJptwjRed9QxfrM 5H4wJttzmVXte2o+V9m6yqw2GKPS+D2GAFMng3wNa3zL8pUvlX2kEricQ2O2xPw93yPj7lUee6WiRi 1ICI+52eA/m9RTRbOmqwAS4IZ2HLkNQ== ARC-Authentication-Results: i=1; outbound4.ore.mailhop.org; spf=softfail smtp.mailfrom=freebsd.org smtp.remote-ip=67.177.211.60; dmarc=none header.from=freebsd.org; arc=none header.oldest-pass=0; DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=outbound.mailhop.org; s=dkim-high; h=content-transfer-encoding:mime-version:content-type:references:in-reply-to: date:cc:to:from:subject:message-id:from; bh=X5ZQIbjd9VJTayqY1aSlDPS0b08971ktiC0E3clcIHs=; b=iVaSN/VWM/tzZLMs04ST2tSEzoYGcmz/jbAJTUasWnOw4Nald5AylIPy9U2TkQOhrOOo1VJP6DRAB 018S0hGn9hFQUSmrUdkh0K3VMzc+JXzL3Goxx9JJYTpy8cAsAOg+RsB3EpeJ1xIwUc8cDDh25GLnwU mRBg/rOgRTpkTZ/gZ9rSC8Zh8zxFTcfs+PuNTvV6ytWucRudMaEtQKQ0g3OOUCr2i9+Mu9AQWXbPz+ WO+XN7oqjmllejJlpF4easC2/ndHrM2l12clGKECj9uepeYElnYOwWZrLcGqdv+ZRyMublTaX+6e1u xO3/UzlSWjiv9EvKRd8hcqM/EhGQfGA== X-MHO-RoutePath: aGlwcGll X-MHO-User: b93682ac-7abb-11ea-a065-6d02e42e573a X-Report-Abuse-To: https://support.duocircle.com/support/solutions/articles/5000540958-duocircle-standard-smtp-abuse-information X-Originating-IP: 67.177.211.60 X-Mail-Handler: DuoCircle Outbound SMTP Received: from ilsoft.org (c-67-177-211-60.hsd1.co.comcast.net [67.177.211.60]) by outbound4.ore.mailhop.org (Halon) with ESMTPSA id b93682ac-7abb-11ea-a065-6d02e42e573a; Thu, 09 Apr 2020 23:42:08 +0000 (UTC) Received: from rev (rev [172.22.42.240]) by ilsoft.org (8.15.2/8.15.2) with ESMTP id 039Ng70X048348; Thu, 9 Apr 2020 17:42:07 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from ian@freebsd.org) Message-ID: Subject: Re: svn commit: r359685 - in head: . etc lib/libc/gen share/mk share/termcap usr.bin/login usr.bin/vgrind usr.sbin/services_mkdb From: Ian Lepore To: rgrimes@freebsd.org, Maxim Sobolev Cc: src-committers , svn-src-all , svn-src-head Date: Thu, 09 Apr 2020 17:42:07 -0600 In-Reply-To: <202004092316.039NGTti010456@gndrsh.dnsmgr.net> References: <202004092316.039NGTti010456@gndrsh.dnsmgr.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="ASCII" X-Mailer: Evolution 3.28.5 FreeBSD GNOME Team Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 48yyNg2kYBz4RKg X-Spamd-Bar: - Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; none X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-1.95 / 15.00]; local_wl_from(0.00)[freebsd.org]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-0.98)[-0.983,0]; ASN(0.00)[asn:16509, ipnet:54.148.0.0/15, country:US]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-0.97)[-0.970,0] X-BeenThere: svn-src-head@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: SVN commit messages for the src tree for head/-current List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 09 Apr 2020 23:42:11 -0000 On Thu, 2020-04-09 at 16:16 -0700, Rodney W. Grimes wrote: > > Well, how many FreeBSD builds have you run in the last year, Rodney, > > personally to care about 0.1s slowdown that it might have caused? We've run > > at least a 1,000 here, probably 3x more. > > That is a non technical personal attack. > > > So yes, the cost is there, the > > cost is well understood and found negligible versus the benefit of having a > > slightly more extensible build system that is slightly easier to understand > > and integrate into bigger projects. > > I do not see how moving 5 values adds any extensibility or any ease of use, > or intergratability. It added an ease of editing the values to one file, > values that *should not be edited inplace*. > > If these values need overridden it should always be done on the make command > line, especially by projects external to FreeBSD. Your "extensible build system" > is reaching into internal project build infustructure in a non-supportable way > if it requires this types of change. > You did not look at the changes carefully enough. This doesn't just gather some values into one place, it replaces instances of hard-coded tool names with variables. To do so, those variables need to be defined somewhere. A new src.tools.mk is a good sensible place for that. Now that you have them all in once place, it doesn't make sense to still have duplicate definitions in other places, everything should refer to the one new source. You have focused in on that last sentence and started complaining about it as if it were the entire change. It's just a minor cleanup which is the natural thing to do given the rest of the change. And the rest of the change is useful in exactly the ways Maxim is saying (I say that as someone who also maintains a large proprietary source base that uses the freebsd build infrastructure). -- Ian