From owner-freebsd-questions@FreeBSD.ORG Sun Mar 10 15:08:35 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: questions@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:1900:2254:206a::19:1]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7920FB6A for ; Sun, 10 Mar 2013 15:08:35 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from gkeramidas@gmail.com) Received: from mail-ee0-f47.google.com (mail-ee0-f47.google.com [74.125.83.47]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id F06B4FC0 for ; Sun, 10 Mar 2013 15:08:34 +0000 (UTC) Received: by mail-ee0-f47.google.com with SMTP id e52so1769138eek.34 for ; Sun, 10 Mar 2013 08:08:28 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=x-received:sender:date:from:to:cc:subject:message-id:references :mime-version:content-type:content-disposition:in-reply-to; bh=WQIa0o9ibkFSO221XZUv1I0a8di+nEvnwFVa3xEN084=; b=tonFbP5c4uhy3SdybhCEFLsD9H+iO2u5+qoBFOtKzt83SvRzEP9WkYqGMnDAAuYRZ2 oQEU9ge8LxLi83iEWRqpyQNnVf5YG8t1qdevRvuEaCtGF70DsWUwuUCxKkLfCjx5SICf jXWny59ozwI8UAI3pptExzcn3CwG/StAHhhTmohz6Z0C7HphTG24j5K0omd+hkUhPf4f gaumSrrbGZHDyjOw15VPiUlrUexzNqowShJZgPxovuFlpt3fnzat92jdimNtVjotoOah 5FVVIaoh3pjb3AwVjO7HDS1PWSVGIxNzsN9GQogFm35hLsCtZhJkzQG06qR3oenbukQ9 AShQ== X-Received: by 10.14.219.7 with SMTP id l7mr17782999eep.12.1362928107927; Sun, 10 Mar 2013 08:08:27 -0700 (PDT) Received: from saturn (217-162-217-29.dynamic.hispeed.ch. [217.162.217.29]) by mx.google.com with ESMTPS id a1sm18628478eep.2.2013.03.10.08.08.25 (version=TLSv1.2 cipher=RC4-SHA bits=128/128); Sun, 10 Mar 2013 08:08:26 -0700 (PDT) Sender: Giorgos Keramidas Date: Sun, 10 Mar 2013 16:08:22 +0100 From: Giorgos Keramidas To: Robert Huff Subject: Re: svn & new pkg system Message-ID: <20130310150820.GA20819@saturn> References: <513BC4E2.4040708@a1poweruser.com> <87ppz8ceje.fsf@kobe.laptop> <20795.63556.581627.956239@jerusalem.litteratus.org> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <20795.63556.581627.956239@jerusalem.litteratus.org> Cc: Fbsd8 , FreeBSD questions X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.14 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 10 Mar 2013 15:08:35 -0000 On 2013-03-09 22:04, Robert Huff wrote: > Giorgos Keramidas writes: > > > Is svn going to become part of the base system in 9.2-RELEASE? > > > > No. > > [good reasons for not including subversion ellided] > > On the other hand ... > > The traditional - and I believe still canonical - way of updating the > system is to recompile from source. > > I know I am not alone in feeling the system is substantially > incomplete if it does not come with all the tools necessary to do > that. > > (Not slighting freebsd-update (don't know enough about it to have an > opinion); just pointing out it has limitations.) This has been traditionally true with CVS, which was also a complex piece of software, but still merged periodically into FreeBSD src. I think it's always a small annoyance when things break away from 'tradition', but on the other hand tradition shouldn't be able to put a stop to moving along or act as an impediment for doing our 'real' work. And the real work of the team is to develop FreeBSD, not to develop a version control system. There's a lot of know-how and development happening in the main Subversion development process; a lof of experience that we do not necessarily need to duplicate in our own team to do what we like best: that is, develop FreeBSD. It's understandable that having to install a package to check-out the sources is a diversion from previous practice, and it may be somewhat annoying -- like every change is annoying at first. But the package is not going to go away and it won't stop working, at least as long as we are using it ourselves to develop the system. So other than the difference that now the sources of the VCS used for development are not part of src/, conceptually there isn't a lot of difference from before. The previous state of things was: FreeBSD developers use CVS to check out the sources, and develop the system itself. CVS is available [as part of the base system] to everyone else who wants to grab a copy of the source tree. WHat happens now is quite similar, except for the bracketed text: FreeBSD developers use SVN to check out the sources, and develop the system itself. SVN is available [as part of the official packages] to everyone else who wants to grab a copy of the source tree.