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[71.223.3.53]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id z11sm7129554pfk.46.2020.07.17.02.05.51 (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 bits=128/128); Fri, 17 Jul 2020 02:05:51 -0700 (PDT) Subject: Re: URGENT: Microsoft overwrites boot loader! To: Polytropon Cc: FreeBSD Mailing List , freebsd-stable@freebsd.org References: <140a6398-f8ad-ecd6-2a6f-5ca28f570a64@gmail.com> <20200717085305.ffd5191c.freebsd@edvax.de> From: Don Wilde Message-ID: <8158aa31-493c-d316-9dbe-fcf35f569baf@gmail.com> Date: Fri, 17 Jul 2020 02:05:50 -0700 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux x86_64; rv:68.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/68.10.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <20200717085305.ffd5191c.freebsd@edvax.de> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Language: en-US X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 4B7QFt4Qgqz3XWK X-Spamd-Bar: --- Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=pass header.d=gmail.com header.s=20161025 header.b=jpy08KmJ; dmarc=pass (policy=none) header.from=gmail.com; spf=pass (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of dwilde1@gmail.com designates 2607:f8b0:4864:20::1041 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=dwilde1@gmail.com X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-3.14 / 15.00]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; TO_DN_SOME(0.00)[]; FREEMAIL_FROM(0.00)[gmail.com]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+ip6:2607:f8b0:4000::/36]; RCVD_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[3]; DKIM_TRACE(0.00)[gmail.com:+]; DMARC_POLICY_ALLOW(-0.50)[gmail.com,none]; NEURAL_HAM_SHORT(-0.18)[-0.184]; SUBJECT_ENDS_EXCLAIM(0.00)[]; RECEIVED_SPAMHAUS_PBL(0.00)[71.223.3.53:received]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; FREEMAIL_ENVFROM(0.00)[gmail.com]; ASN(0.00)[asn:15169, ipnet:2607:f8b0::/32, country:US]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROM(0.00)[]; DWL_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[gmail.com:dkim]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-0.98)[-0.982]; R_DKIM_ALLOW(-0.20)[gmail.com:s=20161025]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; RCPT_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[3]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-0.97)[-0.974]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[2607:f8b0:4864:20::1041:from]; RCVD_TLS_ALL(0.00)[] X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.33 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 17 Jul 2020 09:05:55 -0000 On 7/16/20 11:53 PM, Polytropon wrote: > On Thu, 16 Jul 2020 13:19:51 -0700, Don Wilde wrote: >> The [deleted] ones in Redmond have done it again. My multi-OS GRUB2 boot >> loader is gone, and in its place is a 500M partition called 'Windows >> boot loader'. > They do this all the time. The consensus here is to install > "Windows" first, always, restricted to the designated disk > space, and _then_ install Linux, FreeBSD, GRUB, or anything > else non-"Windows", in order to avoid the exact problem you > are describing. Even older versions of "Windows" were known > to destroy things like the FreeBSD boot manager when they > are installed as a 2nd choice. MICROS~1 always wants you to > treat it first class, with golden feet and glockenspiel. > > However, is my interpretation correct? Did this happen when > you _installed_ "Windows" on that machine for the first time, > or did it happen after you _booted_ an already installed > instance of "Windows", which then did attack "foreign data" > on the disk? This machine still maintains the original Windows installation, first with W7, and then (finally, bad mistake) upgraded to W10. >> The purpose is to force us to look at MS' new version of Edge. All my >> old boot files are gone. > Something like that should never happen. It's absolutely > normal that "Windows" installs software without user consent, > and then presents it prominently in user-configured areas > such as the desktop, the "Start" menu, or the bottom bar > (pun absolutely intended), but it should never exceed its > authority beyong the border of the "Windows" partition, > which clearly means: "Hands off of Grub partition!" Yes. The bastards also screwed up my 128GB backup drive -- again without asking -- when I left it plugged in during a Doze boot. > > Especially with "Windows 10", the PC is no longer a PC, > not a _personal_ computer belonging to the user; it's rather > a system remotely controlled by MICROS~1, and having installed > "Windows" and therefore agreed to the terms of usage (EULA), > there is probably nothing "wrong" with it, because you have > agreed that they can do whatever they want, and if something > goes wrong, it's your fault. Legal business as usual. Yes, agreed. They far outstrip the robber barons of the 1800s in their greed. Even Carnegie finally discovered a heart beating inside of himself, and gave us libraries and Napoleon Hill! > > Many years (or let's say, decades) I had a similar problem > with an OS/2 installation: It messed up the system's partition > table, a system where DOS (not that DOS, the other one) was > installed, and there was a data loss: Partition D: became C:, > E: became D:, F: became E:, and C: along with its content > seemed to be gone. But in the overall "disk space calculation" > it must still have been on disk, so I used the Norton Disk Editor > (DISKEDIT.EXE from Norton Utilities, a great product at that > time!), a handheld calculator and pen & paper to re-calculate > the correct values for the partition table, entered them, > rebooted, prayed unto the holy bringer of peace, Alpha-Omega, > and tadaa, C: was there again, with the correct content. I never had that wonderful luxury of being saddled with a "real" IBM machine or OS/2. One would note that they, too (along with MS, eventually), are being relegated to the dustbin of history where they belong. [snip] >> That's the last time I will allow this, and I'm calling those [deleted]s >> tomorrow to give them a piece of my mind. After that I will erase every >> vestige of that obscene OS from my disk. > They don't mind. They already have your money. And maybe they > even have your name, address, phone number, credit card number > or other banking information... I have a few last resort technologies they *don't* know about, though they are not worth any more of my time or psychic energy. :D -- Don Wilde **************************************************** * What is the Internet of Things but a system * * of systems including humans? * ****************************************************