From owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Thu Jul 5 17:36:01 2012 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [69.147.83.52]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 92A40106564A for ; Thu, 5 Jul 2012 17:36:01 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from yanegomi@gmail.com) Received: from mail-ob0-f182.google.com (mail-ob0-f182.google.com [209.85.214.182]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 506308FC21 for ; Thu, 5 Jul 2012 17:36:01 +0000 (UTC) Received: by obbun3 with SMTP id un3so17203898obb.13 for ; Thu, 05 Jul 2012 10:36:01 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date:message-id:subject:from:to :cc:content-type; bh=GLXyuMNVfOjkLvfXml4JEGG93pSd/16z++sVqzga9Ao=; b=WJy24bq4tvvKoOdZ4NHS0U7SYdDZndPQWbYCuzRu76ulGcxxxQ+ALyxoKppjtvU04z BbHyCagQryPQ9+x0hXWmPhF7CVeXmxM0VSrJ0sGQbh4uJi7+msZDz83S+bquL7KfZ2VB Hj55i1zFidAaP0BtRyf5PxLdFEDwXVOz96NQAw91cDhsIqY123u/OGBPRElBMkVGUE6z 2MaPzcAw29Ut+0+JlW1bCj4qAnNqLp5kWl91wG+0xqCB2kRDN5p3F9WAAkWnHfPL9D+t BVti0s6dJOQRDnTBcQX9adGeo6+or7BRhBMROuhS8rhRyuZDGeqCkaNkpTSSAU3GNTJA yDZA== MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.182.39.39 with SMTP id m7mr22213192obk.20.1341509760899; Thu, 05 Jul 2012 10:36:00 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.76.84.7 with HTTP; Thu, 5 Jul 2012 10:36:00 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: References: <20120705082857.GB37083@server.rulingia.com> <4FF55864.8040807@FreeBSD.org> <201207051215.44799.j.mckeown@ru.ac.za> <4FF5BF27.2030609@my.gd> <4FF5C48C.9030106@my.gd> Date: Thu, 5 Jul 2012 10:36:00 -0700 Message-ID: From: Garrett Cooper To: Warner Losh Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Cc: Wojciech Puchar , freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Training wheels for commandline (was Re: Pull in upstream before 9.1 code freeze?) X-BeenThere: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Technical Discussions relating to FreeBSD List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 05 Jul 2012 17:36:01 -0000 On Thu, Jul 5, 2012 at 10:31 AM, Garrett Cooper wrote: > On Thu, Jul 5, 2012 at 10:18 AM, Warner Losh wrote: >> >> On Jul 5, 2012, at 10:45 AM, Damien Fleuriot wrote: >> >>> >>> On 7/5/12 6:38 PM, Wojciech Puchar wrote: >>>>> inexperienced users. >>>>> >>>>> Having to enable it manually defeats its very purpose. >>>> >>>> so is FreeBSD future direction to be moron-OS just like linux is now, or >>>> is that just another stupid idea on that forum that came and... will pass? >>>> >>>> Quite important. There are still people that want normal OS. >>> >>> >>> Just because you don't like the idea doesn't make it stupid, and just >>> because it comes from linux doesn't make it bad. >> >> Both true. However, if the database lookups took a long time, or had a high overhead to maintain, then it would be stupid to have on by default. > > Here's a *random* thought to consider. This seems like a feature that > FreeNAS/PC-BSD/etc (Linux/Windows/other OS convert) type thing might > want -- so maybe the feature should exist (but be off) in FreeBSD and > exist (and be on) in custom FreeBSD distros where users aren't > necessarily expected to know FreeBSD. And FWIW, this can exist as a *port* which is LD_PRELOADed (or use some other LD* hack) as an opt-in for a select set of shells. -Garrett PS I personally don't care about this feature on FreeBSD, but I understand how to use FreeBSD. I sometimes find it helpful on other OSes like Debian that I don't actively use all of the time.