From nobody Wed Apr 20 08:00:54 2022 X-Original-To: questions@mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id CDE8211CE87C for ; Wed, 20 Apr 2022 08:00:58 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from ralf-mardorf@riseup.net) Received: from mx1.riseup.net (mx1.riseup.net [198.252.153.129]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits) key-exchange X25519 server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) server-digest SHA256 client-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits) client-digest SHA256) (Client CN "mx1.riseup.net", Issuer "R3" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 4KjtQf02bRz3JJf for ; Wed, 20 Apr 2022 08:00:57 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from ralf-mardorf@riseup.net) Received: from fews2.riseup.net (fews2-pn.riseup.net [10.0.1.84]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits) key-exchange X25519 server-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits) server-digest SHA256 client-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits) client-digest SHA256) (Client CN "mail.riseup.net", Issuer "R3" (not verified)) by mx1.riseup.net (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 4KjtQW1RzFzDsNP for ; Wed, 20 Apr 2022 01:00:51 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=riseup.net; s=squak; t=1650441651; bh=lapXMMZ6TGGD7Dw8sFHT2ziO+3f+Ziwhd4mhd1BcN2I=; h=Date:From:To:Subject:In-Reply-To:References:From; b=KjH4JP0ep+ipY8gkwAhGilOhi1kKMdv2at3YNep0TAcZVm9HdueKhkhS8LiBita0d 06bxT2R2bwad8MKMn0fvAPOXxg4znVApSvLl4dGywkr3iiofMRDYZLawuvIoDE+Y3h cqryMXx6LwZ8gUf9hgTBNwPLkPfHBV98KOFpm49M= X-Riseup-User-ID: 3A88D0E7808E5323320A29349FE37CB20C72C9B3D190CE3C353272123E3D5BD1 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by fews2.riseup.net (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 4KjtQV4Hh1z214t for ; Wed, 20 Apr 2022 01:00:50 -0700 (PDT) Date: Wed, 20 Apr 2022 10:00:54 +0200 From: Ralf Mardorf To: questions@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Conventions for FreeBSD manual pages Message-ID: <20220420100054.07129046@archlinux> In-Reply-To: <3755196b-8803-ff72-364e-6b3b067f9702@gmail.com> References: <3755196b-8803-ff72-364e-6b3b067f9702@gmail.com> List-Id: User questions List-Archive: https://lists.freebsd.org/archives/freebsd-questions List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: Sender: owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 4KjtQf02bRz3JJf X-Spamd-Bar: ---- Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=pass header.d=riseup.net header.s=squak header.b=KjH4JP0e; dmarc=pass (policy=none) header.from=riseup.net; spf=pass (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of ralf-mardorf@riseup.net designates 198.252.153.129 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=ralf-mardorf@riseup.net X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-4.10 / 15.00]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; R_DKIM_ALLOW(-0.20)[riseup.net:s=squak]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; RWL_MAILSPIKE_GOOD(0.00)[198.252.153.129:from]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_ALL(0.00)[]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+mx]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; TO_DN_NONE(0.00)[]; PREVIOUSLY_DELIVERED(0.00)[questions@freebsd.org]; RCPT_COUNT_ONE(0.00)[1]; DWL_DNSWL_LOW(-1.00)[riseup.net:dkim]; RCVD_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[3]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-0.50)[-0.505]; DKIM_TRACE(0.00)[riseup.net:+]; DMARC_POLICY_ALLOW(-0.50)[riseup.net,none]; NEURAL_HAM_SHORT(-1.00)[-1.000]; MLMMJ_DEST(0.00)[questions]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; MID_RHS_NOT_FQDN(0.50)[]; ASN(0.00)[asn:16652, ipnet:198.252.153.0/24, country:US]; RCVD_TLS_ALL(0.00)[]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW(-0.10)[198.252.153.129:from] X-ThisMailContainsUnwantedMimeParts: N On Wed, 20 Apr 2022 07:46:54 +0100, Graham Perrin wrote: >I expect alphabetical order, by name. Hi, first a note related to sorting in general and than related to the man pages "SEE ALSO". You shouldn't expect alphabetical order when using software running on any operating system. Computers tend to lexicographical order (this more or less is the alphabetical order), but it comes with pitfalls. Some pitfalls are relatively easy to resolve, such as caused by the Icelandic or German alphabet, but for logographic writing systems it's probably not that easy. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alphabetical_order#Similar_orderings https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lexicographic_order https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Logogram I suspect anything listed by a man page's "SEE ALSO" section is equal in all languages, even when using a logographic writing system, however, sorting by manual sections isn't a bad idea. To separate commands from e.g. devices and drivers can be helpful. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Man_page#Manual_sections Taking a look at the FreeBSD and Linux man pages for "hier", I can't see a difference for the rational behind the "SEE ALSO" sorting. Manual section first, lexicographical order of the names second. [rocketmouse@archlinux ~]$ man hier | grep SEE\ ALSO -A1 SEE ALSO find(1), ln(1), proc(5), file-hierarchy(7), mount(8) https://www.freebsd.org/cgi/man.cgi?hier(7) : SEE ALSO apropos(1), find(1), finger(1), grep(1), ls(1), whatis(1), whereis(1), which(1), fd(4), devfs(5), fsck(8) It apparently a common standard, shared by FreeBSD and Linux, that alone already makes it good. Regards, Ralf