Date: Mon, 3 Jan 2011 11:36:39 -0500 From: Mehmet Erol Sanliturk <m.e.sanliturk@gmail.com> To: Nathan Whitehorn <nwhitehorn@freebsd.org> Cc: freebsd-sysinstall@freebsd.org, freebsd-arch@freebsd.org Subject: Re: BSDInstall: I want the bikeshed painted plaid Message-ID: <AANLkTinOpiFqjdC2GnSuqydWZ=usT_=0MHsbd_s9_tg5@mail.gmail.com> In-Reply-To: <4D21488F.90107@freebsd.org> References: <4D20C8BF.701@freebsd.org> <4D21488F.90107@freebsd.org>
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On Sun, Jan 2, 2011 at 10:54 PM, Nathan Whitehorn <nwhitehorn@freebsd.org>wrote: > On 01/02/11 12:49, Nathan Whitehorn wrote: > >> As those of you who obsessively follow the SVN commit mails may have >> noticed, I recently began work on a new installer, which I have >> tentatively named 'bsdinstall'. You can find the code itself at >> svn://svn.freebsd.org/base/user/nwhitehorn/bsdinstall and a wiki page >> describing it at http://wiki.freebsd.org/BSDInstall. >> >> > Personally I am installing many Linux and BSD operating systems to learn their features as much as possible and to utilize some of them for software development and a base for my developed applications . Up to now I could NOT be able to advance very much . In my daily operations , use of Mandriva Linux come out the best , and continuously I am using it . The main distinguishing differences for me are the following : - For the ordinary user ( not the root or as super user ) : - When a USB stick or external hard disk is attached , automatic mounting and usability of it ( read , write ) at least FAT or NTFS formatted ones ( Mandriva Linux requires other ones to be root mounted , as default ) . - Auto mount of CD or DVD ( especially ones containing data ) . - Usability of USB attached devices such as web camera . - Burning CD or DVD without interfering super user or root privileges . - Allowance of root login in GUI mode at the start up without entry from ordinary user mode into root mode . ( Debian Linux has such an option which asks to root whether root logins will be possible or not in GUI mode . Mandriva Linux has safe mode login with ability using KDE/GNOME ( the installed one ) by startx command , or choice from menu as Console login , and then issuing startx ) . All of the above features are available in Mandriva Linux , and Fedora or Debian Linux ( I did not burn CD or DVD in Fedora or Debian Linux ) . In FreeBSD , after an install , by following a pile of flash cards , it is necessary to enter some of the above features one by one . Up to now I could NOT be able to achieve burning of CD/DVD , auto mount CD/DVD or USB sticks , even I did NOT try to attach external HDD . I am using PC-BSD . It is allowing DVD burning with K3b version 1.0.5 , but very slowly which may be considered unusable . After burning 9 more DVDs , I will erase PC-BSD because I could NOT be able to manage its KDE wall paper which changing it itself , but it is irritating me very much . ( There is NO root login , automounts USB sticks , but not NTFS external HDD ) . Among the BSD operating systems , the best is FreeBSD , with the above missing parts ( at least for me . I can not work with it easily , this may mean that other people will have much more difficulty than me ( I have a PhD in Computer Engineering , and my life is passing in front of the personal computers .) . Another most important problem is hard disk partitioning . In Mandriva Linux , there are two main partitions : sda1 for operating system ( / ) sda6 for /home . During install , if there is an installed system which will be replaced : Check - Install ( upgrade is also available , Install fully installs from scratch ) - Use current partitions It is asking mount points : Give sda1 as / sda6 as /home . It is formatting ONLY and ONLY sda1 , but NOT sda6 ( /home ) . The only loss is user names . During user definitions , IF the SAME USER NAMES are given , all of the data are again belong to their original users without any loss . In that way , I am able to install any new Mandriva Linux version easily . Even when older installed structure is ext3 , but new version is ext4 , it is installing ext3 for the older available structure . I have noticed this after installing all of the operating system on a new disk . Its file system was ext4 , the other one ext3 ( installed on older version ) . My conclusion is that , the hard disk layout structure of FreeBSD , really needs a new design . I am so desperate about such installs that , I am thinking to write a new install program with respect to my experiences . My difficulty is I am not using C and not fluent as much as to write a competent install program . My ideas about partitions are as follows : Partition 1 : Operating System . 2 : Packages / Ports used globally 3 : User definitions ( names , privileges , passwords , etc ) 4 : /home : User data directories ( each user will have a jailed environment , means he/she will be able to pkg_add into HIS/HER environment . The root will add them for global use ) 5. ... others . With one important feature : Partitions 2 , 3 , 4 should be assignable to either a single disk ( with the 1 : Operating system partition ) or MULTIPLE , DIFFERENT disks : In that way default home will be /home , additional home directories in different disk units , for example /homeA , /homeB , ... Therefore , during user definitions , it should be possible to specify his/her home explicitly when there are multiple home directories . With the above layout , it will be possible to install operating system ONLY into its own partition without touching to other partitions when it is decided to upgrade a system in that way . Installing the operating system in the following way , may allow experimenting and using different versions on the same system : /FreeBSD /FreeBSD/8.2/ /FreeBSD/8.3/ /FreeBSD/9.0/ etc. , each one in its own directory with the usual subdirectories . For the packages , require that each package installs into ... /package_name/version/ which will allow installation of different versions in the same partition ( some of the packages are using this structure , but not all of the ) . This is important for different operating system versions . When an additional Operating system is installed , it will FORMAT its own directories , IF there are EXISTING other versions , with some other necessary options , such Format ALL of them . Thank you very much . Mehmet Erol Sanliturk
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