From owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Sun May 29 06:59:20 2005 Return-Path: X-Original-To: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org Delivered-To: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0584616A41C for ; Sun, 29 May 2005 06:59:20 +0000 (GMT) (envelope-from chris@czv.com) Received: from engine140.deployzone.net (engine140.deployzone.net [193.17.85.140]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 8478943D1D for ; Sun, 29 May 2005 06:59:19 +0000 (GMT) (envelope-from chris@czv.com) Received: from adsl-212-90-218-5.cybernet.ch [212.90.218.5] by engine140.deployzone.net; Sun, 29 May 2005 08:58:42 +0200 In-Reply-To: <20050528225538.GD19079@gothmog.gr> References: <20050528165128.DEB8B1F50B1@ws1-2.us4.outblaze.com> <20050528225538.GD19079@gothmog.gr> Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v622) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Message-Id: Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Chris Zumbrunn Date: Sun, 29 May 2005 08:59:17 +0200 To: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.622) Subject: Re: Main site makeover X-BeenThere: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org List-Id: FreeBSD Evangelism List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 29 May 2005 06:59:20 -0000 On May 29, 2005, at 12:55 AM, Giorgos Keramidas wrote: > On 2005-05-28 11:51, Fafa Hafiz Krantz wrote: >>>> What happened to this? >>>> http://www.monkey.org/freebsd/archive/freebsd-advocacy/200412/ >>>> msg00080.html >>>> >>>> I don't know if these were generated from real HTML/CSS or just >>>> created in a graphics editor. >>> >>> Actually, I've seen a front page that Chris did (I think) that's got >>> the nice menu across the top and a really well designed front page. >> >> I just wanted to point out; >> >> There's *nothing* new about that design. >> It still follows the old principles. > > It's ok. Small incremental changes are easier to test and accept than > a > full "throw it all away and use mine" style of update. > > The site now uses CSS a lot more than before, AFAIK. I'm not a web > design guru, but if someone came up with a style that looks like, say, > Wikipedia it would be interesting. > > Any takers who want to try revamping the front page by using *only* CSS > style changes? Yes, that was exactly the idea. There is a version committed in Perforce that took that approach and looks like this: http://czv.com/zones/beastie/freebsd/freebsdweb1h.html http://czv.com/zones/beastie/freebsd/freebsdweb2h.html For now, the logo competition has put a wrench in going live with a small redesign like this. Specially for all the content pages besides the frontpage, it is crucial to implement a redesign in a way that is compatible with the current way these pages are built. A redesign that requires changes beyond that will take forever to implement. What many don't seem to understand is that the technical implementation of the design and the design itself are two different things. They can't both happen at the same time. Changing the technical implementation will be a slow process that requires a long term transition without changing the design at the same time. The redesign itself is something that is implemented within the existing technical framework and can be switched live at once. I still argue that we need to first switch a small redesign live within the current technical framework, then change the technical framework (which will require updates to the markup of all the pages in the www cvs tree for all the languages) and only after that we can undertake a major redesign entirely based on CSS definitions. Going a bit farther with just the frontpage is possible as long as it is in line with the initially simple changes that can be made to the content pages. For example Devon's div-based markup with the dynamic menues that is currently in Perforce: http://czv.com/zones/beastie/freebsd/freebsdweb1j.gif Cheers, Chris chris@czv.com +41 329 41 41 41 Chris Zumbrunn Ventures - http://www.czv.com/ Internet Application Technology - Reduced to the Maximum