From owner-freebsd-fs@freebsd.org Mon May 9 06:26:34 2016 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-fs@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:1900:2254:206a::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 17100B34FB7 for ; Mon, 9 May 2016 06:26:34 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from peter@rulingia.com) Received: from mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (mailman.ysv.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:1900:2254:206a::50:5]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id EE5861D06 for ; Mon, 9 May 2016 06:26:33 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from peter@rulingia.com) Received: by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) id EA465B34FB6; Mon, 9 May 2016 06:26:33 +0000 (UTC) Delivered-To: fs@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:1900:2254:206a::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E7BF6B34FB5 for ; Mon, 9 May 2016 06:26:33 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from peter@rulingia.com) Received: from vps.rulingia.com (vps.rulingia.com [103.243.244.15]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (Client CN "rulingia.com", Issuer "Let's Encrypt Authority X3" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 858611D03; Mon, 9 May 2016 06:26:32 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from peter@rulingia.com) Received: from server.rulingia.com (ppp59-167-167-3.static.internode.on.net [59.167.167.3]) by vps.rulingia.com (8.15.2/8.15.2) with ESMTPS id u496PbFO012458 (version=TLSv1.2 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 bits=256 verify=OK); Mon, 9 May 2016 16:25:43 +1000 (AEST) (envelope-from peter@rulingia.com) X-Bogosity: Ham, spamicity=0.000000 Received: from server.rulingia.com (localhost.rulingia.com [127.0.0.1]) by server.rulingia.com (8.15.2/8.15.2) with ESMTPS id u496PV9a024022 (version=TLSv1.2 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 bits=256 verify=NO); Mon, 9 May 2016 16:25:32 +1000 (AEST) (envelope-from peter@server.rulingia.com) Received: (from peter@localhost) by server.rulingia.com (8.15.2/8.15.2/Submit) id u496PSlf024021; Mon, 9 May 2016 16:25:28 +1000 (AEST) (envelope-from peter) Date: Mon, 9 May 2016 16:25:28 +1000 From: Peter Jeremy To: Lev Serebryakov Cc: Poul-Henning Kamp , George Neville-Neil , fs@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Fwd: The Morning Paper: NOVA - A log-structured file system for hybrid volatile/non-volatile main memories Message-ID: <20160509062528.GB57227@server.rulingia.com> References: <4188b6afbe9e5d43111fef4d4ae5e599a57.20160506051425@mail23.atl91.mcsv.net> <2BE88161-D83A-4265-9EC3-C2F7F7033E93@neville-neil.com> <59877.1462639101@critter.freebsd.dk> <07228891.20160508134321@serebryakov.spb.ru> <62925.1462704459@critter.freebsd.dk> <1058947919.20160508140842@serebryakov.spb.ru> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-sha512; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="PEIAKu/WMn1b1Hv9" Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <1058947919.20160508140842@serebryakov.spb.ru> X-PGP-Key: http://www.rulingia.com/keys/peter.pgp User-Agent: Mutt/1.6.0 (2016-04-01) X-Greylist: Sender succeeded STARTTLS authentication, not delayed by milter-greylist-4.4.3 (vps.rulingia.com [103.243.244.15]); Mon, 09 May 2016 16:25:45 +1000 (AEST) X-BeenThere: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Filesystems List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 09 May 2016 06:26:34 -0000 --PEIAKu/WMn1b1Hv9 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On 2016-May-08 14:08:47 +0300, Lev Serebryakov wrote: >Hello Poul-Henning, > >Sunday, May 8, 2016, 1:47:39 PM, you wrote: > >> The problem with that kind of hardware is that either you specialize >> 100% for that vendors product, with resulting lock-in, or you satisfy >> yourself with a generic solution which works an anything sensible. > >> I don't think FreeBSD has the bandwidth for anything but the second opti= on. > > Really, Intel is not "that vendor" now. It is THE Vendor. FreeBSD has a = LOT >of specialization for this vendor (all i386 code, NVMe, and other), and ma= ny >thing from Intel (or which becomes widespread in Intel-based systems, like >PCI, which is not exactly "from Intel", of course) becomes industrial >standard. There's a difference between FreeBSD having i386/amd64 as the main Tier-1 platform and supporting hardware that is only supported by some (not even all) x86 CPUs manufactured by Intel. There are a number of other vendors that supply i386/amd64-compatible CPUs. Whilst we do have CPU-specific code (for CPU initialisation and hwpmc), there's a big step between that and supporting a filesystem that requires vendor-specific hardware and a vendor-specific CPU. > I don't think such type of memory will be very-Intel-specific for long. HP >works on something comparable, and other companies too. "Something comparable" doesn't mean it'll be compatible - Intel have a vested interest in locking customers into their CPUs. And the hype surrounding "The Machine" has been toned down significantly - suggesting that HP are having a harder time productizing their NVM than they expected. --=20 Peter Jeremy --PEIAKu/WMn1b1Hv9 Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name="signature.asc" -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v2 iQJ8BAEBCgBmBQJXMC1YXxSAAAAAAC4AKGlzc3Vlci1mcHJAbm90YXRpb25zLm9w ZW5wZ3AuZmlmdGhob3JzZW1hbi5uZXRFRUIyOTg2QzMwNjcxRTc0RTY1QzIyN0Ux NkE1OTdBMEU0QTIwQjM0AAoJEBall6Dkogs0XAIQAIRWSAas0E6a6Kzt9irEgSPP hFoiQMzdvBSUgPMwMs6gwURd5ezWLnvFojgHx8AZ+Be9ycs/bqV4PY52VWj0LBLp xkbx67DZfxjNTp3WfhFzGsnikQ9aRfb3e3aKyo8ISjMP/QmB1kLnk+cmEAXXIJUg xeESXtZcX+Rw799vqXpKVG1h0de47+8urQXQ5HEq4JkPz31nB00oFOAjssWY1U9o zbp54igEHzb8kkF8T0bLfBiBZQ4+s/qi4+staT3oSnNzFTbu7cqfaCTK78ecZlQt vhL9GCZOMG3MnBa/p67I1vEDFN/cZdQJL9yyQJ6mNgdR0FF/884hmc+L4EVzw4Gi dcK1m3uBUNDGHzhxqS90mS+ZgmQGtmJ7aYDBJMCyrQ3mhsFEfP9iFlHIusVCrv6P WsmaHQCNWlGr3aEhwqkH1f+Qmxf9w+9inbQMsSj2QY7+bGck7GoryZM72hX9agVu WjtZd4QWJRp+n+Zj2M5YKPR5hqN2QyUhjn+neTsx96ZJlSa+Mfn4RRCebhK/jfBh cee2b4S79fA5ObDYeaxMpBIwYnJLWgiiuUwrXwTDgmy/vDOwUXO9OjIkMnUpxd87 yiUSGFgSEetSAFnHtWwj7O1/eXG+Uv/+5hLYNhXdVl0RzR1sxrZKLtNIZwuMCSIS d19myfHoqVN788Mx7AcM =XVCz -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --PEIAKu/WMn1b1Hv9--