From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Sat Mar 21 13:50:36 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9A6B5263286 for ; Sat, 21 Mar 2020 13:50:36 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from pr0f3ss0r1492@yahoo.com) Received: from sonic307-56.consmr.mail.ne1.yahoo.com (sonic307-56.consmr.mail.ne1.yahoo.com [66.163.190.31]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (Client did not present a certificate) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 48l28m6bprz3wrN for ; Sat, 21 Mar 2020 13:50:32 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from pr0f3ss0r1492@yahoo.com) X-YMail-OSG: EqHWKvgVM1lr2iqhkhJLerM9q5y7.UuyOnUf0WAgG_RtUkdLKhuchqd5leNSvum 2Gr7oFDLYMhv3B3pf1IFWjfpUvQWn97aMOSXDt3Nah5J471b9oArIR81EgheWattUPL1zyUzGUvb a8SbFmpaPWyNop8.vCB6UKQJva3qJHRLLt9_1Qv7vI8ZfjFS2YOlH8qD9OGi9GNEJ9M.R1g4C6CP PB4.Gj5T1fIdh0QGcOmIRRVhCO72HCVA.dZF9g0s.0xqL2CucixUv__QFm5x6ctgwZhR6aZofbhe iEQmlN1jBcAk1NajcZoZdbNBXRfUjo0aIO6HCbPxZ3SAUISMsgnwABBKB1rI4WcWhrICxacKV7iT mjnLylCslZpWChLYPAgvqHKlukWBghudG6YLMs_Dl5ImDXMbVg6E3VYGgzHvibBoria8JG8yeBOp 1xYOv8hgMUFiRF6CpynCr8VbfyTghXdHt_sXj_Qxqd3DNXEW2f4ObW7iV4PKdJC6oU6kBNhNT49W cA9hWCwKy6p9kcJ9ke7GMDS5.4._SnRNrEsbMnQNSf.tBb.n4lhBt7poiCdySTiZe9T.0xShHFfR AEs0EaKNJyVEqd7ffew.PfQ2C9vhoS1v_clUQ12is_2uY7jVJ6y3_E1SsnpBYi1aul7ZIH_Vsx.h gP3KP9m_Bk5aTW5Qsu9aop0DJUVtfAQ36fFAvfxGfXMZZ07kF8hXXX6z6VnGE0Za7DMCbKOOayf5 04dG.gAffc98BwNubaDzd8m1u3pK3Qmv9EUO9VWTjx1djoUr8BeRF5HTPsVA84ynr4z52a.GqoMr OxvfgK6a_o_4yJG1tdewKg7VvVn4jGPn24al2hR7hMjWaSZZcp8NVHKyDoLYpjHLE46_t8C_XkNL OFeP8mUtE5HCY7gZl6LA1CKTZUOpFMmqAtqJ0nIbfxI0fragm9sMaGuiy1hg9jqSg7BqcsqbYCP2 H_ps8heLKKnqcdYB8fkpsxfxFK9k3R7ol6NC01uGFN_TVVETIDEcxOEu6QyBnDeU6CkJBwMNG5Ut CdUz5jFJygtZsAwTBJTBlUlsfRWrwFMHCkQXN0Ap43cdnIMuuGkJ8uPbExlO.YNv8y0491nFBVwf Y2OT19jXT35Ea5oe.gR2wNq7tZ.APh_jDqiXSK5mPAPdj1Qljkqyd4iVhfuHEgJaUEInVCVrMU.j GC2zi3DxbmYLplOQU7pgmEJn.o3iADnrXXCJJQjRKEPGiqrPGHy9mZfTgZEWuTR7Frfq0Bp57eYf tlO9znHpU_MBKbdbDxbBZiIi6.uPGUx9wHNpFAedISRiOos1zzPLTwQgEWSrAu4g._Wq3q07hMgE azwmnDKcSvPdUQoD39ZgL0FlVyoFLGZRzc1x8pzQj4miymyWyd.O7JRh0rfc_l00E3PNdKYs3en3 dmUF7mia_MOtaJjnbipgiE6QDkTJNAvUh Received: from sonic.gate.mail.ne1.yahoo.com by sonic307.consmr.mail.ne1.yahoo.com with HTTP; Sat, 21 Mar 2020 13:50:31 +0000 Received: by smtp409.mail.bf1.yahoo.com (Oath Hermes SMTP Server) with ESMTPA ID 784e2c9c12571795ba43c4f0d3cd62e0; Sat, 21 Mar 2020 13:50:27 +0000 (UTC) Received: by mail-pg1-f178.google.com with SMTP id 37so4545177pgm.11 for ; Sat, 21 Mar 2020 06:50:26 -0700 (PDT) X-Gm-Message-State: ANhLgQ3BcuXUFgxPQ8dfInDROCGX8Dtu7FI7Kqj2YzmXnOZUkMofR4FF i60XHOw8Z2rf4h4Rt2+7ep9jZ3VS7t9GCmS2lj0= X-Google-Smtp-Source: ADFU+vucljq/XGpnUukPnQtqP+muo0ajuEr1LkXnN3rcn2V9bfPE/9dvATGYf6C9P93Wm4wLfgL7n19wGJ1k8qvHovk= X-Received: by 2002:a62:1745:: with SMTP id 66mr15538972pfx.291.1584798625865; Sat, 21 Mar 2020 06:50:25 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <20200321122609.GB5709@schmorp.de> In-Reply-To: <20200321122609.GB5709@schmorp.de> From: Ottavio Caruso Date: Sat, 21 Mar 2020 13:50:09 +0000 X-Gmail-Original-Message-ID: Message-ID: Subject: Re: FreeBSD asking contributors to fix their opinions - is it official? To: Marc Lehmann Cc: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" X-Mailer: WebService/1.1.15511 hermes Apache-HttpAsyncClient/4.1.4 (Java/1.8.0_241) X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 48l28m6bprz3wrN X-Spamd-Bar: + X-Spamd-Result: default: False [1.95 / 15.00]; TO_DN_SOME(0.00)[]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+ptr:yahoo.com]; FREEMAIL_FROM(0.00)[yahoo.com]; RCVD_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[3]; DKIM_TRACE(0.00)[yahoo.com:+]; RCPT_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2]; DMARC_POLICY_ALLOW(-0.50)[yahoo.com,reject]; FORGED_SENDER(0.30)[ottavio2006-usenet2012@yahoo.com,pr0f3ss0r1492@yahoo.com]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; SUBJECT_ENDS_QUESTION(1.00)[]; FREEMAIL_ENVFROM(0.00)[yahoo.com]; ASN(0.00)[asn:36646, ipnet:66.163.184.0/21, country:US]; FROM_NEQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[ottavio2006-usenet2012@yahoo.com,pr0f3ss0r1492@yahoo.com]; DWL_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[yahoo.com.dwl.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.0]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; R_DKIM_ALLOW(-0.20)[yahoo.com:s=s2048]; URIBL_BLOCKED(0.00)[schmorp.de.multi.uribl.com]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; PREVIOUSLY_DELIVERED(0.00)[schmorp@schmorp.de]; NEURAL_SPAM_MEDIUM(0.80)[0.803,0]; IP_SCORE_FREEMAIL(0.00)[]; IP_SCORE(0.00)[ip: (3.73), ipnet: 66.163.184.0/21(1.17), asn: 36646(0.94), country: US(-0.05)]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; NEURAL_SPAM_LONG(0.84)[0.843,0]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[31.190.163.66.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.0]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; RWL_MAILSPIKE_POSSIBLE(0.00)[31.190.163.66.rep.mailspike.net : 127.0.0.17] X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 21 Mar 2020 13:50:36 -0000 On Sat, 21 Mar 2020 at 12:26, Marc Lehmann wrote: > > Hi! > > This is a request to clarify official policy of the FreeBSD project with > regards to regulating opinions - if this list is not the right list to > ask this question, I would be extremely happy if people could direct me > ot a more appropriate forum - I didn't find anything that seemed more > appropriate, so I am posting to this list. Apologies if this was wrong. > > Moving along, today, I received a mail[1] by some adamw@freebsd.org, > asking me to remove what "FreeBSD" perceives to be personal opinions from > my perl module, Canary::Stability[2]. > > His mail is a bit hard to read, as it makes many claims and practically > gives no evidence for them (and most are hard to believe for me, tpo be > honest). The only remotely actionably thing seesm to be that I really need > to remove these personal opinions. > > Since he writes as "@freebsd.org" and he claims that... > > I'd like to strongly urge you to retire Canary::Stability. [...] > > FreeBSD has had to go to lengths to fix Canary::Stability. If you > really are married to the module, can you please [...] remove the > personal opinions? > > If I read this correctly, he is acting in a capacity officially > representing FreeBSD in that matter and seems to indicate that the FreeBSD > project needs to police what it perceives as personal opinions. In fact, > it seems to be the most urgent and pressing matter, as nothing else of > substance was written. > > If true, I would perosnally find this a very sad thing, as I had the > utmost respect for the FreeBSD project, always trying my best to make my > modules portable to it and using it as one of the platforms I test all my > releases on, and Canary::Stability hopefully makes it clear that I take > stability very seriously. > > To me, this sounds rather orwellian, thought police and all, and while I > am maybe a bit too sensitive to these things, I don't consider that a bad > thing at all in these times of ever decreasing civil liberty. > > So my questions are: > > a) Is this (policing opinions and suppressing undesirable opinions) > the official stance of the FreeBSD project? > b) If yes, is this written down somewhere? I.e. is there a list of rules > that projects must fulfill so they don't need any "opinion fixing" by > FreeBSD? > c) If no, is the FreeBSD project fine with adam going around and asking > upstream contributors to police their personal opinions in the name of > the project? > > Thanks a lot for any clarification! > > [1] http://lists.schmorp.de/pipermail/perl/2020q1/000036.html > [2] http://software.schmorp.de/pkg/Canary-Stability.html I'm not affiliated to FreeBSD, but I see nothing wrong in a developer from another project posting onto a public mailing list of another project and voicing his concerns about a particular issue and I see nothing wrong in you posting here and asking for feedback, but at the same time I think you are taking it a bit too personal. I've read [1] and I see nothing that induces to thinking he was speaking on behalf of the whole of FreeBSD. -- Ottavio Caruso