From owner-freebsd-ports@freebsd.org Sun Dec 17 13:57:40 2017 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-ports@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:1900:2254:206a::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9816FE8A81A for ; Sun, 17 Dec 2017 13:57:40 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from gurenchan@gmail.com) Received: from mail-io0-x231.google.com (mail-io0-x231.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4001:c06::231]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (Client CN "smtp.gmail.com", Issuer "Google Internet Authority G2" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 5C24571485; Sun, 17 Dec 2017 13:57:40 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from gurenchan@gmail.com) Received: by mail-io0-x231.google.com with SMTP id h12so7160543iof.6; Sun, 17 Dec 2017 05:57:40 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=eJpcmVaj4VsgDWfbmhvG+ew9NS34WMWxzok6p22DFj8=; b=QVVP7vvT9duCB7Gh8wBaXroZZ5EOUF/arQ390oUe85bVHK5ar6H92Lqt4cqeg7Pjsr Kuux9PHkOfEuvKVrR3LhlGGdv67GDIIVHU4vXghg95f/diZ01mzfBU5GuP7fqND9C0PQ G298m8evZ1dmBuHj/tkOHu1srEkxZnhJLKzcjeK0bF0KwiNlSPCXHjiY2ZmPgdBSYoZE VkEUhpynYBLUG2MBzqbC3pM8qMDzHyB4dABEmWJaMCDwmoZtffJFV9VyzVBFtPrWKmfk LM4fd8dKiWkdgNt1JEzp/sCnRXtkyZG2t+y+yNtRzbDTiY7XgGcnRDD55BkXoFcgIFkU IXug== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=eJpcmVaj4VsgDWfbmhvG+ew9NS34WMWxzok6p22DFj8=; b=jUJrAFlOY+GAPIpesaMg4YF1BZdLIcH9oRvYDP5WgI/n1dP6/RIloMDVm4nvNXJASF yzJaJmK+ZXCZsyB8NAtFX8pEnqvvxsfNoNfbarfQzVZ2ZvA3IkOmDFysw2Wti0xDFjzS UODx2qpOoHru75qGOyoj2UlwoqTaTUGI0/Hdc6cIiedc2f1zDXaJNzFV3uZaHQu3hleH 7eyw4yGeeTxNYRgjVbfs6ZM6CcmQbCXNo/gFSmXHNS0c/yY5fI0yvpcamgLV192IpwYw FxpoXV1l8zboVyxX/j9qpFmrLe6Rq9S9cewCdAvsN6i5xJq9bjD8MbhS41+ZA5I93ml/ xIdQ== X-Gm-Message-State: AKGB3mL5CQcTJIU7fH2d1mC14nMU2wFdndCLIqmOcr1W9mk/0ADrrYR5 dXM+0SWB7vnddzYfHLL+s3dt177fFw03iPTWIOhMeNfL X-Google-Smtp-Source: ACJfBosDvEgx/MsFnyD4lxbhidkXwUCXwVMMDIfgAxJd3ckqmybvZGkOdJKiczknd2Qm+tOGL+6OmIE3dDV03Gv/KEc= X-Received: by 10.107.157.82 with SMTP id g79mr9789335ioe.296.1513519058864; Sun, 17 Dec 2017 05:57:38 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.107.164.203 with HTTP; Sun, 17 Dec 2017 05:57:38 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: <784ef8bf-c9ab-80a0-dae2-b1a0445ce9bf@freebsd.org> References: <784ef8bf-c9ab-80a0-dae2-b1a0445ce9bf@freebsd.org> From: blubee blubeeme Date: Sun, 17 Dec 2017 21:57:38 +0800 Message-ID: Subject: Re: OSS Audio To: Stefan Esser Cc: Sid , Yuri , Freddie Cash , FreeBSD Ports Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.25 X-BeenThere: freebsd-ports@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.25 Precedence: list List-Id: Porting software to FreeBSD List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 17 Dec 2017 13:57:40 -0000 On Sun, Dec 17, 2017 at 9:11 PM, Stefan Esser wrote: > Am 17.12.17 um 02:06 schrieb blubee blubeeme: > > This is why I am bringing up the issue and why I said the first step > would > > be porting the proper 4Front OSS into the kernel. > > > > It doesn't have to be the default at first but if it's not in the kernel > > why bother wasting time to have it rejected because of all the > > misconceptions I've been dealing with in these threads. > > > > Add 4Front OSS to the kernel > > Use the 4.x API/ Documentation > > Add it to an audio programming section of FBSD Handbook > > Upstream changes that make sense > > Simplify audio programming, documentation, all those audio sound servers > > Port device drivers to the OSS Device Driver API: > > http://manuals.opensound.com/sources/drv_index.html > > Do you propose to just update the code to what 4Front provides? > > This may work for you as individual user, but the 4Front license This is not true. The source code is distributed under different license based on the OS. Look at audio/oss src build process. If the code is compiled on Linux it has some Linux type gpl license, if it's on a *BSD it has BSD license, there's also license that suits other platforms as well. There were some closed sourced parts because Hannu was trying different license models to pay the bills but instead of supporting him, everyone forked his code and left so he went on to do something else. > makes > it impossible to commit that version to FreeBSD. (That was the reason > to stay at a reasonably licensed version, very long ago.) > > It seems like everyone has this cloud of OSS is crap floating around in their minds, the guy just wanted to be able to work on his code and not have to write windows drivers at the same time, that's not how things played out. > Or do you propose a clean-room implementation that in the end is fully > compatible with 4Front OSS 4.x, but does not violate their license and > intellectual property rights? > > You are welcome to start with such a clean-room implementation and it > may even be accepted into FreeBSD, once you are ready (provided there > really is no risk of legal problems in any part of the world). > > Regards, STefan > FreeBSD doesn't have many if any audio programmers, most of the programs are ported from other platforms that do not follow good practices, then new devs come along, copy the old coding style and keep on perpetuating the bad habits. I propose properly implementing 4Font OSS 4.x in the FreeBSD kernel, properly using the API as documented on 4Front website. Have 4Front OSS the default audio system in FreeBSD Having proper Audio programming guide in the FreeBSD handbook ditch sndio and all that other stuff and move forward with a clean start and proper documentation for new audio programs. That's why I brought this issue up on this list is to try and hear from people who are doing audio but instead it's just a bunch of noise and misconceptions.