Date: Fri, 12 Jul 2002 01:01:49 -0700 From: Wes Peters <wes@softweyr.com> To: Cy Schubert - CITS Open Systems Group <Cy.Schubert@uumail.gov.bc.ca> Cc: Terry Lambert <tlambert2@mindspring.com>, arch@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Package system wishlist Message-ID: <3D2E8CED.9A6B30D3@softweyr.com> References: <200207120457.g6C4vux4006072@cwsys.cwsent.com>
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Cy Schubert - CITS Open Systems Group wrote:
>
> Sorry for the late reply, management course.
>
> In message <3D2CEBCE.55DC3C6D@softweyr.com>, Wes Peters writes:
> > Cy Schubert - CITS Open Systems Group wrote:
> > >
> > > + Cy's Wishlist:
> > >
> > > o Optional installation of sources. RH's SRPM's is a very poor
> > > example of this. A better example would be what IBM does to
> > > install JES/2 on their MVS system, e.g. an OpenSSH package might
> > > contain source in addition to binaries. The sources would be
> > > installed in /usr/src while the binaries would be installed
> > > in /usr/bin, sbin....
> >
> > Yes! My mythical XML metadata format, with or without external "filesets",
> > would handle this with aplomb. The source set would be included in the
> > metadata and you could skip it or install it as with any other fileset.
> > Come to think of it, you could include the ports Makefile and patches as
> > well. Hmm, that bears some thinking about. Most of what is in a "port"
> > right now is metadata too.
>
> IBM used UCL. XML is better.
>
> >
> > > o Files replaced by a package backed up in case of package removal
> >
> > I'm not sure what you mean here. Be able to create a backup script of
> > the files related to a package for backing up? Be able to restore only
> > missing files from a package? Both seem like good ideas...
>
> If for example openssh-overwrite-base-3.4p1 is installed, the old
> binaries are saved (backed up) before the package is installed. If I
> pkg_delete openssh-overwrite-base-3.4p1, the old ssh files are restored
> (reappear).
Oh, OK, now I see. Yes, of course. ;^)
> > > o Check option: Tell me what it will do without doing it
> > >
> > > o Group option: Install prerequisites
> >
> > Wouldn't you want this to be the default, perhaps with an option to
> > abort if they're not "readily available"???
>
> You're right. Then there should be an option to just install the
> selected packages and nothing else. This would allow for "creative"
> problem solving.
And for just jamming Gimp onto the system when you know it'll do what
you want without lib{greatestgraphicsformatnobodyuses}.so.
> > > o Groupextend option: Install postrequisites, e.g. dependent
> > > packages and patches
> >
> > In other words, roll portupgrade into the system.
>
> Yes.
This (and mergemaster as Terry pointed out) need to be done anyhow.
> > > o Ability to install my own packages on top of packages and
> > > patches, I like to call them USERMODS.
> >
> > Your own packages or your changes to a standard package? I can see the
> > value, but how to do it doesn't leap immediately to mind.
>
> This increases the complexity of the proposed package system. This was
> mentioned as a possible ideal. I doubt this feature would be used
> much. Please use it as you see fit.
Something to think about for the future. Terry mentioned being able
to re-encapsulate edited configuration files, etc. For example, a
package that installs a conf.example file should have the real conf
file associated with it in some way, too.
> > > Ideally everything should install as a package, however that would
> > > create a lot of extra work for us developers. I have yet to think of a
> > > painless way to do this.
> >
> > Yeah, Debian has certainly showed us how NOT to do it. "Which version of
> > /bin/cat do you want?"
>
> Exactly. This had its usefulness in the mainframe world where
> decisions made years ago would cost millions of dollars to undo. OTOH,
> choosing a SYSV init v.s. a BSD init might be nice (just an example, no
> flames please). Ultimately striking the proper balance is our goal.
> Please pick and choose any ideas as you see fit.
With some nice, canned configurations that do a good approximation of
working out of the box.
--
"Where am I, and what am I doing in this handbasket?"
Wes Peters Softweyr LLC
wes@softweyr.com http://softweyr.com/
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