From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Aug 10 16:45:54 2002 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.FreeBSD.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A8ED837B400 for ; Sat, 10 Aug 2002 16:45:51 -0700 (PDT) Received: from pd3mo3so.prod.shaw.ca (h24-71-223-10.cg.shawcable.net [24.71.223.10]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D552643E5E for ; Sat, 10 Aug 2002 16:45:50 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from Colin_Percival@sfu.ca) Received: from pd3mr1so.prod.shaw.ca (pd3mr1so-ser.prod.shaw.ca [10.0.141.177]) by l-daemon (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.1 HotFix 0.8 (built May 12 2002)) with ESMTP id <0H0N00LF6JC9WQ@l-daemon> for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Sat, 10 Aug 2002 17:45:45 -0600 (MDT) Received: from pn2ml10so.prod.shaw.ca (pn2ml10so-qfe0.prod.shaw.ca [10.0.121.80]) by l-daemon (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.1 HotFix 0.8 (built May 12 2002)) with ESMTP id <0H0N009BSJC9P1@l-daemon> for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Sat, 10 Aug 2002 17:45:45 -0600 (MDT) Received: from piii600.sfu.ca (h24-79-84-133.vc.shawcable.net [24.79.84.133]) by l-daemon (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.1 HotFix 0.8 (built May 12 2002)) with ESMTP id <0H0N00AGSJC80B@l-daemon> for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Sat, 10 Aug 2002 17:45:45 -0600 (MDT) Date: Sat, 10 Aug 2002 16:43:54 -0700 From: Colin Percival Subject: Re: release variability In-reply-to: <1028991462.212.32.camel@cocaine> X-Sender: cperciva@popserver.sfu.ca To: Wouter Van Hemel , Colin Percival Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Message-id: <5.0.2.1.1.20020810163418.02072c10@popserver.sfu.ca> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.0.2 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT References: <5.0.2.1.1.20020810024458.02035e48@popserver.sfu.ca> <5.0.2.1.1.20020808000218.01fcd120@popserver.sfu.ca> <5.0.2.1.1.20020810024458.02035e48@popserver.sfu.ca> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG At 16:57 10/08/2002 +0200, Wouter Van Hemel wrote: >On Sat, 2002-08-10 at 15:13, Colin Percival wrote: > > This raises two questions: > > 1. Is there any way I can set up my system to consistently build the same > > world? > >I think what you're trying to do here is impossible. Every condition would >have to be the same as on the initial build machine, and even then, your >time will not always match. Whatever you're trying to do, it seems like >the wrong solution to me... I don't need to build the same result as the machine which built the published -RELEASE; what I'd like to do, however, is perform various builds along the RELENG_x_y branch in such a way that I can identify which files had real changes, so that updates (consisting of only the changed files) can be published. > > 2. Is this really a desireable state of affairs at all? As it is, it is > > practically impossible for someone to `make release` on their own and > > compare their version to the official version to ensure that the build was > > correct. Reproducibility and verifiability are rather important matters > > when it comes to security. > > > >There are better ways to check the integrity of the code. The most simple >way I can think of, is if you e.g. install from a cd, check the md5sum. You misunderstand me. We have to trust the source code we receive; as it is, we have to either build our own release or trust one machine to build it for us. If `make release` always produced the same result given the same source tree, then several machines could build the release and publish the md5 sum of the result. Trusting several independant machines which agree on an answer is much safer than trusting a single machine (and makes that single machine less of a target). Colin Percival To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message