From owner-freebsd-stable@FreeBSD.ORG Tue Feb 14 10:31:56 2012 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-stable@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 93C0D1065673 for ; Tue, 14 Feb 2012 10:31:56 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from alexander@leidinger.net) Received: from mail.ebusiness-leidinger.de (mail.ebusiness-leidinger.de [217.11.53.44]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id ED2248FC19 for ; Tue, 14 Feb 2012 10:31:55 +0000 (UTC) Received: from outgoing.leidinger.net (p4FC4218C.dip.t-dialin.net [79.196.33.140]) by mail.ebusiness-leidinger.de (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 69BAD8448D4; Tue, 14 Feb 2012 11:31:24 +0100 (CET) Received: from webmail.leidinger.net (webmail.Leidinger.net [IPv6:fd73:10c7:2053:1::3:102]) by outgoing.leidinger.net (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 91FAA2FEC; Tue, 14 Feb 2012 11:31:21 +0100 (CET) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=simple/simple; d=leidinger.net; s=outgoing-alex; t=1329215481; bh=e08cBNm+RfGuajNpPAR2wfspbPscxLrupBRSXS36H30=; h=Date:Message-ID:From:To:Cc:Subject:References:In-Reply-To: Content-Type:MIME-Version:Content-Transfer-Encoding; b=K+1PyvxtvI5k8NeiPueTRI3xC9JyklI0SS2Gg7nAlhGSOfM+o01jYfQBqs68FkdGR yNa27sCjLTob4O9TPNlmt/6Y2kcLQWMq6+a+v4nEye9VWYOYlBUwI7uqFrFzYEufBX eAK811w67SXQhcuiv8I40HicRCByaEE/xDaLZGIA7ItyoR0eLDQS1+MlAVMh17twui 7xowgXB9yBavPP1VLLppxSFb5OxaQqym/lulLKf0OaTlHQfZqY00J8EkD4HmSjugPl 70kuVWBDGYyi4aEb7SAakslTzJLDgYUvzby58RAR1/A9jEhpSmX9O68RMhexlFeC2C w0zttw2u6J1nA== Received: (from www@localhost) by webmail.leidinger.net (8.14.5/8.14.4/Submit) id q1EAVKdq015062; Tue, 14 Feb 2012 11:31:20 +0100 (CET) (envelope-from Alexander@Leidinger.net) X-Authentication-Warning: webmail.leidinger.net: www set sender to Alexander@Leidinger.net using -f Received: from 85.94.224.19 ([85.94.224.19]) by webmail.leidinger.net (Horde Framework) with HTTP; Tue, 14 Feb 2012 11:31:20 +0100 Date: Tue, 14 Feb 2012 11:31:20 +0100 Message-ID: <20120214113120.Horde.7fNzdpjmRSRPOjf4S1XjmXA@webmail.leidinger.net> From: Alexander Leidinger To: Paul Schenkeveld References: <20120210145604.Horde.ewjpSpjmRSRPNSH0YRHxgAk@webmail.leidinger.net> <20120210144449.GA2358@psconsult.nl> In-Reply-To: <20120210144449.GA2358@psconsult.nl> User-Agent: Internet Messaging Program (IMP) H4 (5.0.18) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed; DelSp=Yes MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-EBL-MailScanner-Information: Please contact the ISP for more information X-EBL-MailScanner-ID: 69BAD8448D4.A239F X-EBL-MailScanner: Found to be clean X-EBL-MailScanner-SpamCheck: not spam, spamhaus-ZEN, SpamAssassin (not cached, score=-0.766, required 6, autolearn=disabled, AWL -0.66, DKIM_SIGNED 0.10, DKIM_VALID -0.10, DKIM_VALID_AU -0.10, T_RP_MATCHES_RCVD -0.01) X-EBL-MailScanner-From: alexander@leidinger.net X-EBL-MailScanner-Watermark: 1329820286.18387@X9ykEV6ydnI4XUNyVGUkSQ X-EBL-Spam-Status: No Cc: freebsd-stable@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Reducing the need to compile a custom kernel X-BeenThere: freebsd-stable@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Production branch of FreeBSD source code List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 14 Feb 2012 10:31:56 -0000 Quoting Paul Schenkeveld (from Fri, 10 Feb 2012 15:44:50 +0100): > On Fri, Feb 10, 2012 at 02:56:04PM +0100, Alexander Leidinger wrote: >> Hi, >> >> during some big discussions in the last monts on various lists, one of >> the problems was that some people would like to use freebsd-update but >> can't as they are using a custom kernel. With all the kernel modules >> we provide, the need for a custom kernel should be small, but on the >> other hand, we do not provide a small kernel-skeleton where you can >> load just the modules you need. >> >> This should be easy to change. As a first step I took the generic >> kernel and removed all devices which are available as modules, e.g. >> the USB section consists now only of the USB_DEBUG option (so that the >> module is build like with the current generic kernel). I also removed >> some storage drivers which are not available as a module. The >> rationale is, that I can not remove CAM from the kernel config if I >> let those drivers inside (if those drivers are important enough, >> someone will probably fix the problem and add the missing pieces to >> generate a module). >> >> Such a kernel would cover situations where people compile their own >> kernel because they want to get rid of some unused kernel code (and >> maybe even need the memory this frees up). >> >> The question is, is this enough? Or asked differently, why are you >> compiling a custom kernel in a production environment (so I rule out >> debug options zhich are not enabled in GENERIC)? Are there options >> which you add which you can not add as a module (SW_WATCHDOG comes to >> my mind)? If yes, which ones and how important are they for you? > > - INET without INET6 > - SOFTUPDATES, UFS_ACL, AUDIT, SCTP (left out for embedded devices) > - Bj=F6rn may add INET6 without INET > - SCHED_ULE vs. SCHED_4BSD > - No vga console/atkbd/psm for embedded devices > - CPU_SOEKRIS, CPU_GEODE, CPU_ELAN, NO_SWAPPING for embedded devices Embedded devices are out of the scope of this, normally you do a lot of other modifictions to such systems anyway, so a custom kernel should be not a big problem. I will also not touch the dual-stack part of the kernel config (it shall still allow the generic purpose computing like the GERNERIC config). > - IPSTEALTH, IPSEC, IPSEC_FILTERTUNNEL, IPFILTER, ALTQ for firewalls Request noted. > I also always specify exactly one CPU type (on i386), know it made a > difference in the 386/486/586 era but am not sure how much difference > it makes nowadays. The 386 part (which we do not have anymore in GENERIC) made a difference, the rest doesn't hurt in the kernel. Bye, Alexander. -- Smuggling... It's not just a job, it's an adventure! -- paid for by your local Colombian recruiting office http://www.Leidinger.net Alexander @ Leidinger.net: PGP ID =3D B0063FE7 http://www.FreeBSD.org netchild @ FreeBSD.org : PGP ID =3D 72077137