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[209.85.167.178]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id f62sm2143155oib.38.2019.11.08.12.36.10 for (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 bits=128/128); Fri, 08 Nov 2019 12:36:10 -0800 (PST) Received: by mail-oi1-f178.google.com with SMTP id l20so6403859oie.10 for ; Fri, 08 Nov 2019 12:36:10 -0800 (PST) X-Received: by 2002:aca:7583:: with SMTP id q125mr11134800oic.168.1573245369744; Fri, 08 Nov 2019 12:36:09 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <20191108194652.50c4f8e7c87ec76b9abc6e19@sohara.org> <20191108200005.21a9cdac18587cc36bd7cb01@sohara.org> In-Reply-To: <20191108200005.21a9cdac18587cc36bd7cb01@sohara.org> From: Tomasz CEDRO Date: Fri, 8 Nov 2019 21:35:57 +0100 X-Gmail-Original-Message-ID: Message-ID: Subject: Re: 12.1 on Thinkpad - problem making graphics work To: "Steve O'Hara-Smith" Cc: =?UTF-8?Q?Tomasz_Boles=C5=82aw_CEDRO?= , "James E. Pace" , FreeBSD Questions Mailing List X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 478sVj4qtcz3PNY X-Spamd-Bar: --- Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=pass header.d=cedro.info header.s=google header.b=CAP+U1u0; dmarc=none; spf=none (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of tomek@cedro.info has no SPF policy when checking 2607:f8b0:4864:20::32d) smtp.mailfrom=tomek@cedro.info X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-3.53 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; R_DKIM_ALLOW(-0.20)[cedro.info:s=google]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; RCPT_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[4]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[multipart/alternative,text/plain]; PREVIOUSLY_DELIVERED(0.00)[freebsd-questions@freebsd.org]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[cedro.info]; URI_COUNT_ODD(1.00)[3]; RCVD_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[4]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; TO_DN_ALL(0.00)[]; DKIM_TRACE(0.00)[cedro.info:+]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[d.2.3.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.2.0.0.4.6.8.4.0.b.8.f.7.0.6.2.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.0]; R_SPF_NA(0.00)[]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+,1:+,2:~]; IP_SCORE(-2.23)[ip: (-6.73), ipnet: 2607:f8b0::/32(-2.34), asn: 15169(-2.01), country: US(-0.05)]; ASN(0.00)[asn:15169, ipnet:2607:f8b0::/32, country:US]; RCVD_TLS_ALL(0.00)[] Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.29 X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 08 Nov 2019 20:36:14 -0000 my two cents to the release process / attitude: the issue is that i did a release upgrade and my machine is useless out of the box. even worse it crashes the os with mounted root what eventually results in data corruption! no need to mention that data is more precious than hardware itself. the issue is that it should work out of the box without "reading the entire issue" or waste several hours just to fallback to incomplete setup. this is not Linux. i avoid Linux for that. FreeBSD was always "it works stable or its not part of stable" (not to mention a release). We should not accept, ever, this kind of rush, just because others do. We avoid Windows and Linux for that. We never should accept a situation like this in FreeBSD! i never upgraded a server until NN.1 was out. now i have concerns even about NN.1. -- CeDeROM, SQ7MHZ, http://www.tomek.cedro.info