From owner-freebsd-stable@FreeBSD.ORG Fri Feb 7 03:19:11 2014 Return-Path: Delivered-To: stable@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [8.8.178.115]) (using TLSv1 with cipher ADH-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id B2BC5EB5; Fri, 7 Feb 2014 03:19:11 +0000 (UTC) Received: from land.berklix.org (land.berklix.org [144.76.10.75]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 4E0281764; Fri, 7 Feb 2014 03:19:10 +0000 (UTC) Received: from park.js.berklix.net (pD9FBF118.dip0.t-ipconnect.de [217.251.241.24]) (authenticated bits=128) by land.berklix.org (8.14.5/8.14.5) with ESMTP id s173Idwf040295; Fri, 7 Feb 2014 03:18:40 GMT (envelope-from jhs@berklix.com) Received: from fire.js.berklix.net (fire.js.berklix.net [192.168.91.41]) by park.js.berklix.net (8.14.3/8.14.3) with ESMTP id s173J4Z2099587; Fri, 7 Feb 2014 04:19:04 +0100 (CET) (envelope-from jhs@berklix.com) Received: from fire.js.berklix.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by fire.js.berklix.net (8.14.5/8.14.5) with ESMTP id s173Ijvb048532; Fri, 7 Feb 2014 04:18:57 +0100 (CET) (envelope-from jhs@berklix.com) Message-Id: <201402070318.s173Ijvb048532@fire.js.berklix.net> To: stable@freebsd.org, current@freebsd.org Subject: Re: RFC: deprecation of nve(4) in 10-STABLE and removal from 11-CURRENT From: "Julian H. Stacey" Organization: http://berklix.com BSD Unix Linux Consultants, Munich Germany User-agent: EXMH on FreeBSD http://berklix.com/free/ X-URL: http://www.berklix.com In-reply-to: Your message "Thu, 06 Feb 2014 18:52:43 GMT." Date: Fri, 07 Feb 2014 04:18:45 +0100 Cc: pyunyh@gmail.com, David Chisnall , Christian Brueffer X-BeenThere: freebsd-stable@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.17 Precedence: list List-Id: Production branch of FreeBSD source code List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 07 Feb 2014 03:19:11 -0000 Hi, Reference: > From: David Chisnall > Date: Thu, 6 Feb 2014 18:52:43 +0000 David Chisnall wrote: > On 6 Feb 2014, at 18:34, Julian H. Stacey wrote: > > > Best avoid the obscure word `Deprecated' in manuals: > > It's not common/ plain English. Maybe a geek import, or USA > > dialect ? It's not easily internationaly understood English. > > Best make manuals easier for non native English speakers (& native > > English too ;-). I am British born & bred, whether in English > > speaking circles in UK or Germany I never hear or read 'deprecated' > > unless its in BSD context. Few native English speakers I know will be > > immediately sure of the meaning, it's too obscure. > > I'd strongly disagree with this. Deprecated is, perhaps, only in common use as jargon, but it's very widespread within the tech field. I don't think I've ever read an API reference that doesn't include the word, for example, and it's even a keyword in many code documentation tools. For example, JavaDoc supports @deprecated and gcc / clang include an __attribute__((deprecated)) that generates a compile-time warning whenever anyone tries to call a deprecated function. > > I've not come across the word outside of tech uses, but I've also not come across the term network interface outside of tech circles. Deprecated, in this use, may be jargon, but it's very widespread jargon, and requesting it not be used sounds like asking for words like driver or processor also be avoided. > > David > (Also a native English speaker, although familiar with the unofficial fork from Leftpondia) Uh Huh ;-) http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/Leftpondia American 1620 fork of English deduced. 1620: When a Mayflower butter maid Deprecated a milk maid giving 20 ounces to a pint, & confused USA liquids down to 16 ounces. (Beware man units). Amerian is not always best international English. It's a big early variant of English, but other native English speakers round the globe well outnumber American I believe. (Start with a map of the Commonwealth), & many 2nd language people too will help define international English, (as José Manuel Barroso, EU commission president, said), not just natives, eg British or Americans etc, will get to shape international English. Americans often seem to find it harder to grasp what's internationaly portable English, as opposed to American, perhaps because a large country makes a higher percentage of language experience internal national usage. FreeBSD's manual writers, especially non native English manual writers, should not copy Americanisms &/or bad nomenclature from one manual to another, but ask themselves if they know better words, to make it easier also for other non native English to read. eg Deprecated is not common English. PS Light relief: http://www.bbc.com/future/story/20140206-can-drones-be-hacked Cheers, Julian -- Julian Stacey, BSD Unix Linux C Sys Eng Consultant, Munich http://berklix.com Interleave replies below like a play script. Indent old text with "> ". Send plain text, not quoted-printable, HTML, base64, or multipart/alternative.