From owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG Sat Jan 25 01:12:54 2014 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-current@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [8.8.178.115]) (using TLSv1 with cipher ADH-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 1CE86300; Sat, 25 Jan 2014 01:12:54 +0000 (UTC) Received: from luigi.brtsvcs.net (luigi.brtsvcs.net [IPv6:2607:fc50:1000:1f00::2]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id E19601D53; Sat, 25 Jan 2014 01:12:53 +0000 (UTC) Received: from chombo.houseloki.net (c-76-115-19-22.hsd1.or.comcast.net [76.115.19.22]) by luigi.brtsvcs.net (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 5FB302D4FB2; Fri, 24 Jan 2014 17:12:52 -0800 (PST) Received: from [IPv6:2601:7:880:bd0:b40d:eb14:4f81:f42f] (unknown [IPv6:2601:7:880:bd0:b40d:eb14:4f81:f42f]) by chombo.houseloki.net (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 84ABE4F3; Fri, 24 Jan 2014 17:12:50 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <52E30F9C.7090607@bluerosetech.com> Date: Fri, 24 Jan 2014 17:13:00 -0800 From: Darren Pilgrim User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 6.1; WOW64; rv:24.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/24.2.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Mark Felder , freebsd-current@freebsd.org Subject: Re: freebsd-update References: <5F09668C-0DEA-4074-A06C-BC4D29F92368@FreeBSD.org> <201401211149.45793.jhb@freebsd.org> <1390591900.23972.74968289.53788D17@webmail.messagingengine.com> In-Reply-To: <1390591900.23972.74968289.53788D17@webmail.messagingengine.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-BeenThere: freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.17 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about the use of FreeBSD-current List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 25 Jan 2014 01:12:54 -0000 On 1/24/2014 11:31 AM, Mark Felder wrote: > I agree with the rest of this thread. This is just awful. I'm basically > forced to do source based updates when jumping major versions because > freebsd-update is a nightmare to use. I've yet to go through a freebsd-update process that didn't require a manual clean-up afterward. It's easier (and faster) to build an obj tree on my desktop, ship it to my servers via NFS over a tunnel. Another scenario I've run into more than once: - Install release m.x - Realize there's a kernel/driver bug, fixed in m-stable - Source upgrade to m-stable - Release m.z happens, contains fix - Freebsd-update upgrade to m.z The updater will discover that all of /etc differs by $Id tag. A few will have non-edit differences. The rest are either default-empty files or files not found in the distribution (pf.conf, sshd keys, etc.). Freebsd-update will force me to manually approve every single change. With mergemaster, automatic upgrade takes care of all but the edits and provides a MUCH nicer diff editor for those. Mergemaster is a <1 minute process, even on I/O-constrained hardware. I understand that when freebsd-update was written there were "some problems" with the existing install/merge tools used for source upgrades; but I have to wonder: what issues could be so bad that the above is the lesser evil? Freebsd-update's merge needs to learn what mergemaster's can do. Until then, freebsd-update is a non-starter, IMO.