From owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG Sun Feb 23 19:31:42 2014 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-current@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:1900:2254:206a::19:1]) (using TLSv1 with cipher ADH-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 62460C3B for ; Sun, 23 Feb 2014 19:31:42 +0000 (UTC) Received: from mail-oa0-x229.google.com (mail-oa0-x229.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4003:c02::229]) (using TLSv1 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-RC4-SHA (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 234D61CF4 for ; Sun, 23 Feb 2014 19:31:42 +0000 (UTC) Received: by mail-oa0-f41.google.com with SMTP id o6so6166303oag.28 for ; Sun, 23 Feb 2014 11:31:41 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=message-id:date:from:user-agent:mime-version:to:subject:references :in-reply-to:content-type:content-transfer-encoding; bh=Y/6cXKZjJl7jdqP990kCMlyovr0Aw5Waz6S/EE8/CxY=; b=Pfd5CbsVo05N1geot9N1acydtIEUFAsLjOJwMavLz2FoMJkN5J1jUnQSmVyUyqmj8X +S8F3vyzoYf8AtN2dCZTn6r4sanfVnSA6hLoSc8sZyc8lOLzSXJ4DRH3rUiMZeWOnlI7 ecdoY1KnT9phgvSFweIbKIhmRXaexZGlyuHFOYeHtMLM9T7sWhUfqCzvv5MM3YRuN5oS kCVYrKUfxw3YdJeAEdFZ1+gRnfv4H1bDVi//EIrL1OY0v+wPH7kZ8LztO5ci9U3u6ghP Mlxl4rEMgq+7lwOkKfkXEUCTIC432LTnYF7PjAdcHZ5Tgzqa/w0kqSPzQ/1Ac/mzkMLA XA3w== X-Received: by 10.182.22.33 with SMTP id a1mr14747550obf.60.1393183901491; Sun, 23 Feb 2014 11:31:41 -0800 (PST) Received: from [192.168.1.156] ([72.189.249.168]) by mx.google.com with ESMTPSA id x3sm88187515oek.3.2014.02.23.11.31.40 for (version=TLSv1 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-RC4-SHA bits=128/128); Sun, 23 Feb 2014 11:31:41 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <530A4C9B.6050808@gmail.com> Date: Sun, 23 Feb 2014 14:31:39 -0500 From: OutBackDingo User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux x86_64; rv:24.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/24.2.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freebsd-current@freebsd.org Subject: Re: libinit idea References: <20140223182232.GA25967@lucius.XxX> <3F3C8E1C-C58C-4489-9762-ACA742B2A0C4@FreeBSD.org> <1084e79a6f6ff62ed3dca5ee0bcd45f3@mail.lifanov.com> In-Reply-To: <1084e79a6f6ff62ed3dca5ee0bcd45f3@mail.lifanov.com> X-Enigmail-Version: 1.6 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-BeenThere: freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.17 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about the use of FreeBSD-current List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 23 Feb 2014 19:31:42 -0000 -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 On 02/23/2014 02:09 PM, Nikolai Lifanov wrote: > On 2014-02-23 13:47, David Chisnall wrote: >> On 23 Feb 2014, at 18:31, Freddie Cash >> wrote: >> >>> The main developer for systemd is very anti-portability and >>> anti-!Linux. He had actively rejected patches that made his >>> projects work on non-Linux systems. In order to port systemd to >>> a non-Linux system, he wants you to first implement every Linux >>> feature that systemd uses. >>> >>> systemd is a non-starter, and not with considering. >> >> I don't think that's a relevant discussion. The license would >> likely preclude systemd from making it into the base system >> anyway. Please let's not be too negative about the author of >> systemd: he's responsible for more people switching from Linux to >> FreeBSD than any other single individual I can think of and I >> would strongly encourage him to continue. >> > > I also noticed this. > >> The relevant question is whether it does anything in a way that >> is sufficiently sensible to merit a FreeBSD service management >> infrastructure doing it in the same (or a similar) way. >> >> Oh, two things missing from my original list: >> >> - Service jails should be able to run without an init process, >> with just the required libraries installed and the host machine's >> init system starting the jail and the service process(es) inside >> it. >> > > Isn't this a bit too complicated? If there is an init script under > $jail/usr/local/etc/rc.d, then the host init will need to find it, > which can be even more complicated if rc search path in the jail is > customized (prefixed if it's managed by a different department, for > example). Host init will have to read the jail configuration, parse > it too, and then manage children and pids of the jailed services, > including reparenting, all within a jail context. Then the admin in > that jail would need to be able to restart services, affecting host > init, which opens a whole new can of worms. If init program is > skinny and not too complicated, which it is, there is no tangible > overhead. And if a jail really needs a single simple service, init > process in the jail can *be* that, like jexec myjail /bin/sh -c > somestuff (or even /usr/local/bin/myservice -c myservice conf). > >> - The init system should use process descriptors, not pids, for >> tracking processes, preventing issues with pid reuse and so on >> (and removing the need to write pid files). If process >> descriptors do not provide the required functionality (e.g. the >> ability to trace forked children) then this should be added. >> > > This is a good idea. > >> David openrc already does this and runs on FreeBSD, ive been using it on 5 boxes in testing so far, clealy replaces init without breaking rc.conf configurations. >> >> _______________________________________________ >> freebsd-current@freebsd.org mailing list >> http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-current To >> unsubscribe, send any mail to >> "freebsd-current-unsubscribe@freebsd.org" > _______________________________________________ > freebsd-current@freebsd.org mailing list > http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-current To > unsubscribe, send any mail to > "freebsd-current-unsubscribe@freebsd.org" -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1 iQEcBAEBAgAGBQJTCkyWAAoJEP7cFACJNhNalmgH/1hquNUT75g4xOGc8CX+RyVD kVYKW2SUgMOCCQwgXMydsZUafQ8kLSU24H8T9W2J/q2WDm1lWedqeO9/yk7t3pNS 8+c8YsTIuAYtPgiBES65YW667Cj9+FwN268fEqF58/WNS6kNx8snCfoRkvy6l7jN M62ajdNJtgSxF/Iwyfuq4W6REBW3CF4rL+g64OGrK8PQ6yPteJfM3CUGQoUlHXZC KHHY+qMYBSb/H0j9z7PzcpJsC/bb4fJRzccfVc34IV0ovdevLtQeJojTy4E55NhB kWTX1EDRYVxv9Zvy1uPut5qAtc0b+UB5sAPON0RGxBB0rzjzIYZXlieKo4s752w= =BXYO -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----