From nobody Tue Nov 15 17:04:12 2022 X-Original-To: freebsd-ppc@mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4NBXbF3Jhcz4hFWZ for ; Tue, 15 Nov 2022 17:04:25 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from wlosh@bsdimp.com) Received: from mail-ej1-x62d.google.com (mail-ej1-x62d.google.com [IPv6:2a00:1450:4864:20::62d]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 (128/128 bits) key-exchange X25519 server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) server-digest SHA256 client-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits) client-digest SHA256) (Client CN "smtp.gmail.com", Issuer "GTS CA 1D4" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 4NBXbF11lXz3xZQ for ; Tue, 15 Nov 2022 17:04:25 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from wlosh@bsdimp.com) Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; none Received: by mail-ej1-x62d.google.com with SMTP id i10so28974930ejg.6 for ; Tue, 15 Nov 2022 09:04:25 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=bsdimp-com.20210112.gappssmtp.com; s=20210112; h=cc:to:subject:message-id:date:from:in-reply-to:references :mime-version:from:to:cc:subject:date:message-id:reply-to; bh=1LGpoyz85bH4CbR6GFFz9ktsQ5yvJvM/d56upEGlHhE=; b=WIEjJKUXTr2j+dROzUoYbvu8t6rzx4/ScVEFkO3Ix+XoH675sqVqbuvEL6iBfpxJD2 YUtc222/bg6BMQnBR/HgFnZ8sRxGDq2aruDJ7biz4zpOxUAdjY6ZYKZO+NE7DSm44ie3 Ij/AA52z4pcr7WM3STmTqokdcJkCZXFQ1JHmchKoLmmfO10LrxWPMSyD+V8GVZRtDh/l DV2NPhi1APu51c+UjDNe1ny1vuNwn47IG1oRGcejzKQ8QiGMJ/JFzWO8hpB50flnKd0M 9Mo1GNqoXRaYqjIQZX9HdvMq7sKDaunWZGTMWho0k2sXzAIyaEyNubEoahUjpqRAncQa FSvQ== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20210112; h=cc:to:subject:message-id:date:from:in-reply-to:references :mime-version:x-gm-message-state:from:to:cc:subject:date:message-id :reply-to; bh=1LGpoyz85bH4CbR6GFFz9ktsQ5yvJvM/d56upEGlHhE=; b=aEd18GazHsuwFmJAGhdm4jvFpZd2p2/1TH86031H6dhw5tSaT6Jr+To6/UW8uyn2G4 rhN854/8jLBPaZvAsF6xcSwUV65X4OX8G++ttzq1BklokDLjml36+WRtyH5cGoUd39Xi ur3DF7+efPNBUe7UVMQtSit+OlAX9lv5wiGgjjUeNVT7ri5JytfCHsGOykRI96XZbGnq giEUhtMb00z7h2fr3gtwA7t7ce7apO/jHWngO/7oNkyYTWTDMiSr50rH0pjYZvxJ5aLW d5FG7TegC23HxuC6vvIXQKwC6DSzfDnMd+/oRZWGsEZVSzrC3UjOGQhBfk9ouYz2S3Qy t4cA== X-Gm-Message-State: ANoB5pm3jXJnC2VkPZkD6MclR7JgoixwYwo7+ZKr+D9i+X0FfndBCUPp JMu7g9a2l0hWZw6VKuTaUmAqXbL8oeHnrcFku5iHWzUgUtk= X-Google-Smtp-Source: AA0mqf6AdEerTfq6sA/jvZKTnhWZfQJZQkUrWCrVTNwe+eiSE8WB8DCMsagMOpfIy5lIH87Xf+KmsDAaWVDFXhicgBU= X-Received: by 2002:a17:907:bc6:b0:7ae:1e53:95b2 with SMTP id ez6-20020a1709070bc600b007ae1e5395b2mr14165540ejc.333.1668531863361; Tue, 15 Nov 2022 09:04:23 -0800 (PST) List-Id: Porting FreeBSD to the PowerPC List-Archive: https://lists.freebsd.org/archives/freebsd-ppc List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: Sender: owner-freebsd-ppc@freebsd.org X-BeenThere: freebsd-ppc@freebsd.org MIME-Version: 1.0 References: In-Reply-To: From: Warner Losh Date: Tue, 15 Nov 2022 10:04:12 -0700 Message-ID: Subject: Re: Boot Loader: OFW network booting support To: Alexey Dokuchaev Cc: "freebsd-arch@freebsd.org" , FreeBSD PowerPC ML Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="00000000000003303005ed8559c4" X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 4NBXbF11lXz3xZQ X-Spamd-Bar: ---- X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-4.00 / 15.00]; REPLY(-4.00)[]; ASN(0.00)[asn:15169, ipnet:2a00:1450::/32, country:US] X-Rspamd-Pre-Result: action=no action; module=replies; Message is reply to one we originated X-ThisMailContainsUnwantedMimeParts: N --00000000000003303005ed8559c4 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" On Mon, Nov 14, 2022, 6:30 PM Alexey Dokuchaev wrote: > On Mon, Nov 14, 2022 at 09:34:25AM -0700, Warner Losh wrote: > > I'd like to drop support for OFW network booting. > > > > These days, the only OpenFirmware machines are really old Mac G4 and G5 > > machines. Nothing else can use it (it used to be shared with sparc64 > > machines). > > Which are still in use. Particularly, Mac mini G4 and Power Mac G5 make > good backup/storage boxes and just nice piece of hardware to have around. > Ok. But surely not a lot of them anymore... > So, rather than do a lot of work I can barely test (I might have an old G4 > > mac in my dad's old thing), I'm thinking about dropping the support, > > especially since I don't think it's been used by anybody in a long time. > > Netbooting had always been preferred over to flashing optical media due > to how easy it is to setup. This is the first option recommended by > grehan@ > in his guide* and that's how I installed FreeBSD on all my G4/G5 machines. > > My votes goes to keep it. > You are asking for at least two hours of my time to code and test what i know i can. Likely 4 or 5 more if I have to setup and debug netbooting for an old g4 Mac tower I have (including time to find vga monitors, keyboards etc that I have, but are buried in my crawlspace). So here's the deal. If someone has the ability to test and shows that it's working today and promises to test my changes and help me debug it, then I'll keep it and add the new code that's needed to continue to support this feature. Alternatively, if someone has the recipe for FreeBSD/powerpc on QEMU that includes OpenFirmware for disks and networking, I'll do the testing and legwork to get my netboot setup locally. Otherwise, I'm going to save myself some time and this feature will be no more. I'm not going to speculatively waste time for something nobody can even be bothered to demonstrate still works :) Harsh, yes, I know, but better to be up-front about it and quietly break it which I'm pretty sure is what will happen if I don't test the new code. Warner ./danfe > > *) https://people.freebsd.org/~grehan/install.html > --00000000000003303005ed8559c4 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable


=
On Mon, Nov 14, 2022, 6:30 PM Alexey = Dokuchaev <danfe@= freebsd.org> wrote:
On Mon, = Nov 14, 2022 at 09:34:25AM -0700, Warner Losh wrote:
> I'd like to drop support for OFW network booting.
>
> These days, the only OpenFirmware machines are really old Mac G4 and G= 5
> machines. Nothing else can use it (it used to be shared with sparc64 > machines).

Which are still in use.=C2=A0 Particularly, Mac mini G4 and Power Mac G5 ma= ke
good backup/storage boxes and just nice piece of hardware to have around.

Ok= . But surely not a lot of them anymore...

=
> So, rather than do a lot of work I can barely test (I might have an ol= d G4
> mac in my dad's old thing), I'm thinking about dropping the su= pport,
> especially since I don't think it's been used by anybody in a = long time.

Netbooting had always been preferred over to flashing optical media due
to how easy it is to setup.=C2=A0 This is the first option recommended by g= rehan@
in his guide* and that's how I installed FreeBSD on all my G4/G5 machin= es.

My votes goes to keep it.
You are asking for at least two hours of my time t= o code and test what i know i can. Likely 4 or 5 more if I have to setup an= d debug netbooting for an old g4 Mac tower I have (including time to find v= ga monitors, keyboards etc that I have, but are buried in my crawlspace).

So here's the deal. I= f someone has the ability to test and shows that it's working today and= promises to test my changes and help me debug it, then I'll keep it an= d add the new code that's needed to continue to support this feature.

Alternatively, if someone= has the recipe=C2=A0for FreeBSD/powerpc on QEMU that includes OpenFirmware= for disks and networking, I'll do the testing and legwork to get my ne= tboot setup locally.

Otherwise, I'= ;m going to save myself some time and this feature will be no more. I'm= not going to speculatively waste time for something nobody can even be bot= hered to demonstrate still works :) Harsh, yes, I know, but better to be up= -front about it and quietly break it which I'm pretty sure is what will= happen if I don't test the new code.

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