Date: Sat, 12 Feb 2000 13:30:47 +0800 From: Peter Wemm <peter@netplex.com.au> To: Laurence Berland <stuyman@confusion.net> Cc: Andrew Kenneth Milton <akm@mail.theinternet.com.au>, hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: My views on Eclipse/BSD Message-ID: <20000212053047.0CC201CD7@overcee.netplex.com.au> In-Reply-To: Message from Laurence Berland <stuyman@confusion.net> of "Fri, 11 Feb 2000 23:38:31 EST." <38A4E3C6.4A3F828E@confusion.net>
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One key thing to keep in mind is that copyrights apply automatically regardless of age, contracts etc. You have no right to copy a copyrighted work unless the right to do so is given to you (or you have statutory rights such as making backups etc). In this case, you don't have the right to redistribute it except those granted by the license with it's conditions. If you don't accept the license or cannot because you're under the age of being able to enter into a contract or whatever, then you can't redistribute it *period*. You can download it (they are distributing it, not you), and do pretty much whatever you like with it once they've given it to you, but you can't give it to anyone else. This means that if you were under 18 etc, you probably could use it for commercial purposes if you believed the license didn't apply. (And Lucent/whoever *do* own the copyright on the additional Eclipse stuff). Licenses that attempt to impose conditions on what you can personally do with it once you've got it (especially "shrink wrap" licenses) are on very shakey ground anyway - especially if it's sold. You'll note that many such licenses have a little note that says "this license does not affect whatever statutory rights you may have" - in many cases this shoots the bulk of license down as most of it tries to set up conditions and restrictions on rights that you are granted by law and that the license cannot restrict. This varies a lot from country to country. If you're intending to exploit this sort of thing, you'd better see a lawyer. :-) Laurence Berland wrote: > Well the idea is that someone under 18 in the US can't legally be party > to a contract, so the contract becomes null and void even if I agree to > it. There's lots of legal precedent on this. It may not be this way in > other countries (I take it Australia is different). So if we get stuck > with evil shrink wrap licenses, I could charge ppl five dollars to > unwrap and unseal software for them or something. This certainly isn't > something I would do, but I'm talking theory. There was hooplah when > Corel wouldn't let ppl under 18 download their Linux, but it was to > protect them. However, since I could just lie, I could download it > anyway, and they could do nothing. I'd have breeched the contract, but > since I can't be a party to it anyway, there's nothing they can do. I'm > not a lawyer, heck I'm still in my last term of high school, so this is > all of course just my take on it, but it seems fairly consistent in the > cases I've seen. Since the Eclipse people didnt put anything about age > in there (at least I didn't notice it), it would appear I am now the > proud owner of unencumbered code and they have no possible recourse. I > don't think this should be abused or anything; I'd probably have trouble > when I turn 18, and it just doesn't seem right to me. Perhaps some > other minor is braver than I. > > > Regards, > Laurence > > Andrew Kenneth Milton wrote: > > > > +----[ Laurence Berland ]--------------------------------------------- > > | Most licenses aren't all that enforceable. I was speaking with a lawyer > > | friend who theorized that if the person accepting the license was under > > | 18 (in the US at least) then they could do whatever they want with it. > > > > If you are unable to enter into that contract, then you would not legally > > be able to download the code. > > > > -- > > Totally Holistic Enterprises Internet| P:+61 7 3870 0066 | Andrew Milton > > The Internet (Aust) Pty Ltd | F:+61 7 3870 4477 | > > ACN: 082 081 472 | M:+61 416 022 411 | Carpe Daemon > > PO Box 837 Indooroopilly QLD 4068 |akm@theinternet.com.au| > > -- > Laurence Berland, Stuyvesant HS Debate > <><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><> > Windows 98: n. > useless extension to a minor patch release for > 32-bit extensions and a graphical shell for a > 16-bit patch to an 8-bit operating system > originally coded for a 4-bit microprocessor, > written by a 2-bit company that can't stand for > 1 bit of competition. > http://stuy.debate.net > icq #7434346 aol imer E1101 > The above email Copyright (C) 2000 Laurence Berland > All rights reserved To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message
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