Date: Wed, 14 Jul 2010 23:57:13 +0200 From: Alexander Best <alexbestms@uni-muenster.de> To: Paul B Mahol <onemda@gmail.com> Cc: freebsd-questions@FreeBSD.org Subject: Re: buffer starvation when recording DVDs Message-ID: <AANLkTinHSOwqg_nemomgDeDW4rdHPdWa51oMjTRE7P0R@mail.gmail.com> In-Reply-To: <AANLkTiktkbhBNtFbqnV4FdzfQsCWJu0MgnxEKx8XmcbC@mail.gmail.com> References: <AANLkTik7WRzcFoeEVj_UoIe0oO8cRXABflsaIOFAY7eZ@mail.gmail.com> <AANLkTin1Tg3i0Q0ndUABxcUQsPJgBexpbIwN4plkqIud@mail.gmail.com> <AANLkTilQS04hwIPbccSEoIPVSlZFBdtBT4FhxyH8cxRZ@mail.gmail.com> <AANLkTikegRPYMB6OJ6Bg57GfVneR4kj_MdUJJKyyOSq6@mail.gmail.com> <AANLkTik7djAG3aUA1mPFJsKMBVuuwQBlnFoB3se2WJ4l@mail.gmail.com> <AANLkTimLieTK8ErhamGkCrK3YQgI9XgU_0bJ69D5l_D-@mail.gmail.com> <AANLkTiktkbhBNtFbqnV4FdzfQsCWJu0MgnxEKx8XmcbC@mail.gmail.com>
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2010/7/14 Paul B Mahol <onemda@gmail.com>: > On 7/14/10, Alexander Best <alexbestms@uni-muenster.de> wrote: >> 2010/7/14 Paul B Mahol <onemda@gmail.com>: >>> On Wed, Jul 14, 2010 at 1:25 PM, Alexander Best >>> <alexbestms@uni-muenster.de> wrote: >>>> 2010/7/14 Paul B Mahol <onemda@gmail.com>: >>>>> On Wed, Jul 14, 2010 at 12:46 PM, Alexander Best >>>>> <alexbestms@uni-muenster.de> wrote: >>>>>> 2010/7/14 Alexander Best <alexbestms@uni-muenster.de>: >>>>>>> hi there, >>>>>>> >>>>>>> my dvdr drive supports recording DVDs (both DVD-Rs and DVD+Rs) at a >>>>>>> maximum speed of 16x. however at speeds of more than ~12x the burner's >>>>>>> buffer get's filled only ~20%. probably that's why the burner's speed >>>>>>> get's reduced by `growisofs` (to prevent buffer starvation?). how can >>>>>>> this happen? the iso i am using lies on my HDD which is quite fast >>>>>>> (connected via SATA 2.0). >>>>>>> >>>>>>> this is the output of `camcontrol devlist -v`: >>>>>>> >>>>>>> scbus0 on ahcich0 bus 0: >>>>>>> <> at scbus0 target -1 lun -1 () >>>>>>> scbus1 on ahcich1 bus 0: >>>>>>> <> at scbus1 target -1 lun -1 () >>>>>>> scbus2 on ata2 bus 0: >>>>>>> <HL-DT-ST DVDRAM GSA-H10N JL12> at scbus2 target 0 lun 0 >>>>>>> (cd0,pass0) >>>>>>> <> at scbus2 target -1 lun -1 () >>>>>>> scbus3 on ahcich2 bus 0: >>>>>>> <SAMSUNG SP2504C VT100-50> at scbus3 target 0 lun 0 >>>>>>> (ada0,pass1) >>>>>>> <> at scbus3 target -1 lun -1 () >>>>>>> scbus4 on ahcich3 bus 0: >>>>>>> <> at scbus4 target -1 lun -1 () >>>>>>> scbus5 on ahcich4 bus 0: >>>>>>> <> at scbus5 target -1 lun -1 () >>>>>>> scbus6 on ahcich5 bus 0: >>>>>>> <> at scbus6 target -1 lun -1 () >>>>>>> scbus7 on ahcich6 bus 0: >>>>>>> <> at scbus7 target -1 lun -1 () >>>>>>> scbus8 on ahcich7 bus 0: >>>>>>> <> at scbus8 target -1 lun -1 () >>>>>>> scbus-1 on xpt0 bus 0: >>>>>>> <> at scbus-1 target -1 lun -1 (xpt0) >>>>>>> >>>>>>> as you can see cd0 and ada0 don't share the same cable (cd0 is PATA, >>>>>>> ada0 is SATA). the PATA and SATA controllers are: >>>>>>> >>>>>>> atapci0: <JMicron JMB363 UDMA133 controller> port >>>>>>> 0xd000-0xd007,0xd100-0xd103,0xd200-0xd207,0xd300-0xd303,0xd400-0xd40f >>>>>>> irq 16 at device 0.1 on pci3 >>>>>>> >>>>>>> ahci0: <JMicron JMB363 AHCI SATA controller> mem 0xf8000000-0xf8001fff >>>>>>> irq 19 at device 0.0 on pci3 >>>>>> >>>>>> sorry for the wrong information. just realized my HDD is connected to >>>>>> the intel controller! >>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> this is the output of `growisofs`: >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Executing 'builtin_dd if=new.iso of=/dev/pass0 obs=32k seek=0' >>>>>>> /dev/pass0: "Current Write Speed" is 16.4x1352KBps. >>>>>>> 0/4695924736 ( 0.0%) @0x, remaining ??:?? RBU 100.0% UBU >>>>>>> 0.0% >>>>>>> 0/4695924736 ( 0.0%) @0x, remaining ??:?? RBU 100.0% UBU >>>>>>> 0.0% >>>>>>> 0/4695924736 ( 0.0%) @0x, remaining ??:?? RBU 100.0% UBU >>>>>>> 0.0% >>>>>>> 0/4695924736 ( 0.0%) @0x, remaining ??:?? RBU 100.0% UBU >>>>>>> 0.0% >>>>>>> 0/4695924736 ( 0.0%) @0x, remaining ??:?? RBU 100.0% UBU >>>>>>> 0.0% >>>>>>> 0/4695924736 ( 0.0%) @0x, remaining ??:?? RBU 100.0% UBU >>>>>>> 0.0% >>>>>>> 0/4695924736 ( 0.0%) @0x, remaining ??:?? RBU 100.0% UBU >>>>>>> 0.0% >>>>>>> 1114112/4695924736 ( 0.0%) @0.2x, remaining 2036:44 RBU 100.0% UBU >>>>>>> 2.9% >>>>>>> 1114112/4695924736 ( 0.0%) @0.0x, remaining 2247:26 RBU 100.0% UBU >>>>>>> 100.0% >>>>>>> 19365888/4695924736 ( 0.4%) @4.0x, remaining 144:53 RBU 100.0% UBU >>>>>>> 100.0% >>>>>>> 52789248/4695924736 ( 1.1%) @7.2x, remaining 57:10 RBU 99.9% UBU >>>>>>> 100.0% >>>>>>> 86736896/4695924736 ( 1.8%) @7.4x, remaining 37:11 RBU 100.0% UBU >>>>>>> 100.0% >>>>>>> 121241600/4695924736 ( 2.6%) @7.5x, remaining 28:55 RBU 100.0% UBU >>>>>>> 97.1% >>>>>>> 156336128/4695924736 ( 3.3%) @7.6x, remaining 23:42 RBU 99.9% UBU >>>>>>> 97.1% >>>>>>> 191954944/4695924736 ( 4.1%) @7.7x, remaining 20:20 RBU 100.0% UBU >>>>>>> 100.0% >>>>>>> 228130816/4695924736 ( 4.9%) @7.8x, remaining 18:16 RBU 100.0% UBU >>>>>>> 100.0% >>>>>>> 264863744/4695924736 ( 5.6%) @8.0x, remaining 16:27 RBU 100.0% UBU >>>>>>> 100.0% >>>>>>> 298352640/4695924736 ( 6.4%) @7.3x, remaining 15:13 RBU 100.0% UBU >>>>>>> 100.0% >>>>>>> 336134144/4695924736 ( 7.2%) @8.2x, remaining 14:16 RBU 100.0% UBU >>>>>>> 100.0% >>>>>>> 374505472/4695924736 ( 8.0%) @8.3x, remaining 13:16 RBU 100.0% UBU >>>>>>> 100.0% >>>>>>> 413401088/4695924736 ( 8.8%) @8.4x, remaining 12:25 RBU 99.9% UBU >>>>>>> 100.0% >>>>>>> 452886528/4695924736 ( 9.6%) @8.6x, remaining 11:52 RBU 100.0% UBU >>>>>>> 100.0% >>>>>>> 492896256/4695924736 (10.5%) @8.7x, remaining 11:13 RBU 100.0% UBU >>>>>>> 97.1% >>>>>>> 533495808/4695924736 (11.4%) @8.8x, remaining 10:39 RBU 100.0% UBU >>>>>>> 97.1% >>>>>>> 574619648/4695924736 (12.2%) @8.9x, remaining 10:16 RBU 99.7% UBU >>>>>>> 100.0% >>>>>>> 616333312/4695924736 (13.1%) @9.0x, remaining 9:49 RBU 99.9% UBU >>>>>>> 97.1% >>>>>>> 658538496/4695924736 (14.0%) @9.1x, remaining 9:24 RBU 100.0% UBU >>>>>>> 94.1% >>>>>>> 701366272/4695924736 (14.9%) @9.3x, remaining 9:06 RBU 100.0% UBU >>>>>>> 97.1% >>>>>>> 744751104/4695924736 (15.9%) @9.4x, remaining 8:45 RBU 99.9% UBU >>>>>>> 97.1% >>>>>>> 788660224/4695924736 (16.8%) @9.5x, remaining 8:25 RBU 100.0% UBU >>>>>>> 97.1% >>>>>>> 833159168/4695924736 (17.7%) @9.6x, remaining 8:11 RBU 100.0% UBU >>>>>>> 97.1% >>>>>>> 878182400/4695924736 (18.7%) @9.8x, remaining 7:53 RBU 100.0% UBU >>>>>>> 97.1% >>>>>>> 923762688/4695924736 (19.7%) @9.9x, remaining 7:37 RBU 100.0% UBU >>>>>>> 97.1% >>>>>>> 969932800/4695924736 (20.7%) @10.0x, remaining 7:25 RBU 100.0% UBU >>>>>>> 97.1% >>>>>>> 1011908608/4695924736 (21.5%) @9.1x, remaining 7:13 RBU 100.0% UBU >>>>>>> 97.1% >>>>>>> 1059094528/4695924736 (22.6%) @10.2x, remaining 6:58 RBU 100.0% UBU >>>>>>> 97.1% >>>>>>> 1106903040/4695924736 (23.6%) @10.4x, remaining 6:48 RBU 100.0% UBU >>>>>>> 97.1% >>>>>>> 1155203072/4695924736 (24.6%) @10.5x, remaining 6:35 RBU 100.0% UBU >>>>>>> 97.1% >>>>>>> 1204092928/4695924736 (25.6%) @10.6x, remaining 6:22 RBU 99.9% UBU >>>>>>> 97.1% >>>>>>> 1253507072/4695924736 (26.7%) @10.7x, remaining 6:13 RBU 100.0% UBU >>>>>>> 97.1% >>>>>>> 1303511040/4695924736 (27.8%) @10.8x, remaining 6:01 RBU 100.0% UBU >>>>>>> 97.1% >>>>>>> 1354039296/4695924736 (28.8%) @10.9x, remaining 5:50 RBU 100.0% UBU >>>>>>> 97.1% >>>>>>> 1405124608/4695924736 (29.9%) @11.1x, remaining 5:41 RBU 100.0% UBU >>>>>>> 91.2% >>>>>>> 1456832512/4695924736 (31.0%) @11.2x, remaining 5:31 RBU 99.9% UBU >>>>>>> 97.1% >>>>>>> 1509031936/4695924736 (32.1%) @11.3x, remaining 5:21 RBU 100.0% UBU >>>>>>> 97.1% >>>>>>> 1561821184/4695924736 (33.3%) @11.4x, remaining 5:13 RBU 99.9% UBU >>>>>>> 97.1% >>>>>>> 1615134720/4695924736 (34.4%) @11.6x, remaining 5:03 RBU 100.0% UBU >>>>>>> 91.2% >>>>>>> 1669005312/4695924736 (35.5%) @11.7x, remaining 4:53 RBU 100.0% UBU >>>>>>> 97.1% >>>>>>> 1723465728/4695924736 (36.7%) @11.8x, remaining 4:46 RBU 100.0% UBU >>>>>>> 91.2% >>>>>>> 1778417664/4695924736 (37.9%) @11.9x, remaining 4:37 RBU 100.0% UBU >>>>>>> 97.1% >>>>>>> 1834024960/4695924736 (39.1%) @12.0x, remaining 4:28 RBU 99.5% UBU >>>>>>> 97.1% >>>>>>> 1884389376/4695924736 (40.1%) @10.9x, remaining 4:22 RBU 100.0% UBU >>>>>>> 47.1% >>>>>>> 1941012480/4695924736 (41.3%) @12.3x, remaining 4:14 RBU 99.9% UBU >>>>>>> 97.1% >>>>>>> 1998159872/4695924736 (42.6%) @12.4x, remaining 4:05 RBU 100.0% UBU >>>>>>> 97.1% >>>>>>> 2055897088/4695924736 (43.8%) @12.5x, remaining 3:58 RBU 96.6% UBU >>>>>>> 94.1% >>>>>>> 2113961984/4695924736 (45.0%) @12.6x, remaining 3:50 RBU 100.0% UBU >>>>>>> 82.4% >>>>>>> 2172977152/4695924736 (46.3%) @12.8x, remaining 3:42 RBU 100.0% UBU >>>>>>> 79.4% >>>>>>> 2232188928/4695924736 (47.5%) @12.8x, remaining 3:36 RBU 100.0% UBU >>>>>>> 79.4% >>>>>>> 2292154368/4695924736 (48.8%) @13.0x, remaining 3:28 RBU 100.0% UBU >>>>>>> 73.5% >>>>>>> 2352218112/4695924736 (50.1%) @13.0x, remaining 3:21 RBU 99.9% UBU >>>>>>> 41.2% >>>>>>> 2406875136/4695924736 (51.3%) @11.8x, remaining 3:15 RBU 100.0% UBU >>>>>>> 23.5% >>>>>>> 2462351360/4695924736 (52.4%) @12.0x, remaining 3:09 RBU 100.0% UBU >>>>>>> 20.6% >>>>>>> 2512650240/4695924736 (53.5%) @10.9x, remaining 3:04 RBU 100.0% UBU >>>>>>> 20.6% >>>>>>> 2568781824/4695924736 (54.7%) @12.2x, remaining 2:58 RBU 99.8% UBU >>>>>>> 20.6% >>>>>>> 2625634304/4695924736 (55.9%) @12.3x, remaining 2:52 RBU 99.9% UBU >>>>>>> 20.6% >>>>>>> 2682814464/4695924736 (57.1%) @12.4x, remaining 2:46 RBU 100.0% UBU >>>>>>> 20.6% >>>>>>> 2740486144/4695924736 (58.4%) @12.5x, remaining 2:41 RBU 99.9% UBU >>>>>>> 20.6% >>>>>>> 2785411072/4695924736 (59.3%) @9.7x, remaining 2:37 RBU 99.5% UBU >>>>>>> 20.6% >>>>>>> 2840920064/4695924736 (60.5%) @12.0x, remaining 2:31 RBU 100.0% UBU >>>>>>> 97.1% >>>>>>> 2896461824/4695924736 (61.7%) @12.0x, remaining 2:26 RBU 100.0% UBU >>>>>>> 94.1% >>>>>>> 2951970816/4695924736 (62.9%) @12.0x, remaining 2:21 RBU 100.0% UBU >>>>>>> 97.1% >>>>>>> 3007479808/4695924736 (64.0%) @12.0x, remaining 2:15 RBU 99.9% UBU >>>>>>> 97.1% >>>>>>> 3063021568/4695924736 (65.2%) @12.0x, remaining 2:11 RBU 99.8% UBU >>>>>>> 88.2% >>>>>>> 3118497792/4695924736 (66.4%) @12.0x, remaining 2:05 RBU 100.0% UBU >>>>>>> 97.1% >>>>>>> 3174039552/4695924736 (67.6%) @12.0x, remaining 2:00 RBU 100.0% UBU >>>>>>> 97.1% >>>>>>> 3229581312/4695924736 (68.8%) @12.0x, remaining 1:56 RBU 99.9% UBU >>>>>>> 97.1% >>>>>>> 3285090304/4695924736 (70.0%) @12.0x, remaining 1:51 RBU 100.0% UBU >>>>>>> 97.1% >>>>>>> 3340599296/4695924736 (71.1%) @12.0x, remaining 1:46 RBU 100.0% UBU >>>>>>> 97.1% >>>>>>> 3396141056/4695924736 (72.3%) @12.0x, remaining 1:41 RBU 99.9% UBU >>>>>>> 97.1% >>>>>>> 3451682816/4695924736 (73.5%) @12.0x, remaining 1:36 RBU 99.9% UBU >>>>>>> 97.1% >>>>>>> 3507191808/4695924736 (74.7%) @12.0x, remaining 1:32 RBU 100.0% UBU >>>>>>> 94.1% >>>>>>> 3562733568/4695924736 (75.9%) @12.0x, remaining 1:27 RBU 100.0% UBU >>>>>>> 91.2% >>>>>>> 3618242560/4695924736 (77.1%) @12.0x, remaining 1:23 RBU 100.0% UBU >>>>>>> 91.2% >>>>>>> 3673784320/4695924736 (78.2%) @12.0x, remaining 1:18 RBU 100.0% UBU >>>>>>> 94.1% >>>>>>> 3729293312/4695924736 (79.4%) @12.0x, remaining 1:14 RBU 100.0% UBU >>>>>>> 94.1% >>>>>>> 3784835072/4695924736 (80.6%) @12.0x, remaining 1:09 RBU 100.0% UBU >>>>>>> 94.1% >>>>>>> 3840344064/4695924736 (81.8%) @12.0x, remaining 1:05 RBU 100.0% UBU >>>>>>> 97.1% >>>>>>> 3895885824/4695924736 (83.0%) @12.0x, remaining 1:00 RBU 100.0% UBU >>>>>>> 70.6% >>>>>>> 3951427584/4695924736 (84.1%) @12.0x, remaining 0:56 RBU 100.0% UBU >>>>>>> 97.1% >>>>>>> 4006936576/4695924736 (85.3%) @12.0x, remaining 0:51 RBU 100.0% UBU >>>>>>> 97.1% >>>>>>> 4062478336/4695924736 (86.5%) @12.0x, remaining 0:47 RBU 100.0% UBU >>>>>>> 97.1% >>>>>>> 4118020096/4695924736 (87.7%) @12.0x, remaining 0:43 RBU 100.0% UBU >>>>>>> 97.1% >>>>>>> 4173529088/4695924736 (88.9%) @12.0x, remaining 0:39 RBU 100.0% UBU >>>>>>> 97.1% >>>>>>> 4229103616/4695924736 (90.1%) @12.0x, remaining 0:34 RBU 100.0% UBU >>>>>>> 97.1% >>>>>>> 4284579840/4695924736 (91.2%) @12.0x, remaining 0:30 RBU 100.0% UBU >>>>>>> 97.1% >>>>>>> 4340154368/4695924736 (92.4%) @12.0x, remaining 0:26 RBU 100.0% UBU >>>>>>> 97.1% >>>>>>> 4395663360/4695924736 (93.6%) @12.0x, remaining 0:22 RBU 100.0% UBU >>>>>>> 97.1% >>>>>>> 4451237888/4695924736 (94.8%) @12.0x, remaining 0:18 RBU 99.9% UBU >>>>>>> 97.1% >>>>>>> 4506779648/4695924736 (96.0%) @12.0x, remaining 0:13 RBU 99.9% UBU >>>>>>> 97.1% >>>>>>> 4562321408/4695924736 (97.2%) @12.0x, remaining 0:09 RBU 99.9% UBU >>>>>>> 97.1% >>>>>>> 4617830400/4695924736 (98.3%) @12.0x, remaining 0:05 RBU 100.0% UBU >>>>>>> 97.1% >>>>>>> 4673372160/4695924736 (99.5%) @12.0x, remaining 0:01 RBU 67.3% UBU >>>>>>> 97.1% >>>>>>> builtin_dd: 2292944*2KB out @ average 9.9x1352KBps >>>>>>> /dev/pass0: flushing cache >>>>>>> /dev/pass0: closing track >>>>>>> /dev/pass0: closing disc >>>>>>> >>>>>>> i also noticed this output (console): >>>>>>> >>>>>>> (cd0:ata2:0:0:0): READ TOC/PMA/ATIP. CDB: 43 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 4 0 >>>>>>> (cd0:ata2:0:0:0): CAM status: SCSI Status Error >>>>>>> (cd0:ata2:0:0:0): SCSI status: Check Condition >>>>>>> (cd0:ata2:0:0:0): SCSI sense: ILLEGAL REQUEST csi:43,0,0,e asc:24,0 >>>>>>> (Invalid field in CDB): Command byte 6 is invalid >>>>>>> (cd0:ata2:0:0:0): READ TOC/PMA/ATIP. CDB: 43 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 4 0 >>>>>>> (cd0:ata2:0:0:0): CAM status: SCSI Status Error >>>>>>> (cd0:ata2:0:0:0): SCSI status: Check Condition >>>>>>> (cd0:ata2:0:0:0): SCSI sense: ILLEGAL REQUEST csi:43,0,0,e asc:24,0 >>>>>>> (Invalid field in CDB): Command byte 6 is invalid >>>>>>> >>>>>>> my motherboard features a second SATA controller: >>>>>>> >>>>>>> ahci1: <Intel ICH9 AHCI SATA controller> port >>>>>>> 0xe600-0xe607,0xe700-0xe703,0xe800-0xe807,0xe900-0xe903,0xea00-0xea1f >>>>>>> mem 0xf8206000-0xf82067ff irq 19 at device 31.2 on pci0 >>>>>> >>>>>> this one! >>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> should i consider moving my hdd to this controller? i heard the >>>>>>> jmicron controllers don't work very well under freebsd. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> i'm running >>>>>>> >>>>>>> FreeBSD otaku 9.0-CURRENT FreeBSD 9.0-CURRENT #4 r209884: Sat Jul 10 >>>>>>> 19:25:16 CEST 2010 root@otaku:/usr/obj/usr/src/sys/ARUNDEL amd64 >>>>>>> >>>>>>> with >>>>>>> >>>>>>> options ATA_CAM >>>>>>> >>>>>>> in my kernel config. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> cheers. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> ps: during the `growisofs` session i made sure that no other >>>>>>> application was causing heavy HDD activity!!! >>>>> >>>>> How much is your HDD really fast(when reading that iso file)? >>>> >>>> dd if=/dev/ada0 of=/dev/null bs=1M count=4482 >>>> 4482+0 records in >>>> 4482+0 records out >>>> 4699717632 bytes transferred in 66.619926 secs (70545224 bytes/sec) >>>> >>> >>> ISO file != start of disk >> >> oh sorry. here're a couple of different tests. i'm not sure if they >> are useful because of the effects of caching: >> >> dd if=/dev/cd0 of=./test.iso bs=2048 >> 2293232+0 records in >> 2293232+0 records out >> 4696539136 bytes transferred in 1581.225780 secs (2970189 bytes/sec) >> >> dd if=test.iso of=/dev/null bs=1M >> 4478+1 records in >> 4478+1 records out >> 4696539136 bytes transferred in 101.192359 secs (46411994 bytes/sec) >> >> time cp test.iso /dev/null >> cp test.iso /dev/null 0,00s user 7,98s system 7% cpu 1:39,78 total >> >>> >>>>> >>>>> Usually when I use growisofs, files I burn are located on tmpfs or are >>>>> completly cached in VM (yes, that is hardcore) >>>> >>>> thanks for the hint. although i use tmpfs i only have 2GB of RAM. >>>> that's why an entire DVD image (4.377 GiB) cannot reside inside tmpfs >>>> (or any other memory backed fs) on my machine. >>>> >>>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> -- >>>> Alexander Best >>>> >>> > > I'm not really expert in those things, perhaps firmware for your > burner is not up to date or have some limitations. > > Can be anything from flaky disc being burned to cdrecord. > You are burning DVD-R or DVD+R? > You tested with other disc vendors to see if there is anything different .... i'm using DVD+Rs. unfortunately i don't have any DVD-Rs available right now. this might be an issue with growisofs. i'm not using cdrecord. i don't think it's capable of burning DVDs, but i might be wrong there. i guess i'll have to bite the bullet and run more tests. just thought this was a common issue and somebody already came up with a solution. thanks for your help. ps: i've added freebew-questions@ > -- Alexander Best
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