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Date:      Tue, 29 Nov 2005 22:24:59 -0500
From:      Kris Kennaway <kris@obsecurity.org>
To:        Colin Percival <cperciva@freebsd.org>
Cc:        freebsd-security@freebsd.org, aristeu <suporte@wahtec.com.br>, Kris Kennaway <kris@obsecurity.org>
Subject:   Re: Reflections on Trusting Trust
Message-ID:  <20051130032459.GA63255@xor.obsecurity.org>
In-Reply-To: <438D0961.40307@freebsd.org>
References:  <20051129120151.5A2FB16A420@hub.freebsd.org> <002601c5f4fa$b5115320$e403000a@rickderringer> <20051129232703.GA60060@xor.obsecurity.org> <438CE78F.303@freebsd.org> <20051130000552.GB60924@xor.obsecurity.org> <438D0961.40307@freebsd.org>

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On Tue, Nov 29, 2005 at 06:07:29PM -0800, Colin Percival wrote:
> Kris Kennaway wrote:
> > On Tue, Nov 29, 2005 at 03:43:11PM -0800, Colin Percival wrote:
> >>Even before you get to that point, you have to worry about making sure
> >>that the build clients are secure.  One possibility which worries me a
> >>great deal is that a trojan in the build code for a low-profile port
> >>(e.g., misc/my-port-which-nobody-else-uses) could allow an attacker to
> >>gain control of a build client (and then insert trojans into packages
> >>which are built there).
> >=20
> > They're closed systems that I keep up-to-date with security fixes, but
> > yes, this is something that we do not defend against.  As you note,
> > it's not really practical to at the moment, so the best we can do is
> > just keep it in mind and look for other things to fix.
>=20
> Yes and no.  Fixing other potential security risks is good, but not if
> it leads users to think that the packages are more trustworthy than they
> really are.  In particular, if we started distributing signed packages,
> I suspect that most people would assume that the signatures guaranteed
> that the packages were good, rather than simply ensuring that the packages
> hadn't been modified with after they were built.
>=20
> If we're going to sign anything, we need to ensure not just that we're
> signing what we think we're signing, but also that we're signing what the
> *end users* think that we're signing.

Seems to me that ignorance and a false sense of security is bad
wherever it appears, so all we can do is try our best to educate users
about what they're getting.

Kris


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