From owner-freebsd-questions@FreeBSD.ORG Thu Oct 8 23:13:00 2009 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 312201065672 for ; Thu, 8 Oct 2009 23:13:00 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from perrin@apotheon.com) Received: from outbound-mail-145.bluehost.com (outbound-mail-145.bluehost.com [67.222.38.35]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id F23D48FC16 for ; Thu, 8 Oct 2009 23:12:59 +0000 (UTC) Received: (qmail 21850 invoked by uid 0); 8 Oct 2009 23:12:59 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO box543.bluehost.com) (74.220.219.143) by outboundproxy5.bluehost.com with SMTP; 8 Oct 2009 23:12:59 -0000 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=default; d=apotheon.com; h=Date:From:To:Subject:Message-ID:Mail-Followup-To:References:Mime-Version:Content-Type:Content-Disposition:In-Reply-To:User-Agent:X-Identified-User; b=BFsGj4eBcuZXNPFO+TxMD63fZmSO97fPhgOgUAzzRjRfG7tmU75LCiQng7r3dpOuQRTPLHduZddGOEK8d0vLoM9/wecs1RtmO3nVOvH6s5s9/xnHz/SfJGu/TUdxM0BE; Received: from c-24-8-180-234.hsd1.co.comcast.net ([24.8.180.234] helo=kukaburra.hydra) by box543.bluehost.com with esmtpsa (TLSv1:AES256-SHA:256) (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1Mw2AM-0007gI-LC; Thu, 08 Oct 2009 17:12:59 -0600 Received: by kukaburra.hydra (sSMTP sendmail emulation); Thu, 8 Oct 2009 17:05:33 -0600 Date: Thu, 8 Oct 2009 17:05:33 -0600 From: Chad Perrin To: ports@freebsd.org, freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Message-ID: <20091008230533.GA32736@guilt.hydra> Mail-Followup-To: ports@freebsd.org, freebsd-questions@freebsd.org References: <20090930161915.GA18014@lonesome.com> <20091001111417.GF50565@hades.panopticon> <20091001112323.GA26407@droso.net> <20091001114546.GH50565@hades.panopticon> <20091001213656.GA14925@lonesome.com> <20091002133231.GA17567@hades.panopticon> <747dc8f30910061024h5346b25evd27369955f9d6768@mail.gmail.com> <20091007184310.GC19063@guilt.hydra> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-sha1; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="ew6BAiZeqk4r7MaW" Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: User-Agent: Mutt/1.4.2.3i X-Identified-User: {2737:box543.bluehost.com:apotheon:apotheon.org} {sentby:smtp auth 24.8.180.234 authed with ren@apotheon.org} Cc: Subject: Re: ion windows manager on FreeBSD X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 08 Oct 2009 23:13:00 -0000 --ew6BAiZeqk4r7MaW Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On Thu, Oct 08, 2009 at 11:19:00AM -0300, Carlos A. M. dos Santos wrote: > On Wed, Oct 7, 2009 at 3:43 PM, Chad Perrin wrote: > > On Wed, Oct 07, 2009 at 01:25:35PM -0300, Carlos A. M. dos Santos wrote: > >> > >> You can fork the code, rename it, whatever, but you can NOT change > >> the license without explicit permission from the original copyright > >> owner. That would be legally considered theft! > > > > Incorrect. =A0It would be legally considered copyright infringement. > > Copyright law is not property law, and both different laws *and* > > different terms apply. =A0"Theft" is not a term legally applied to > > copyright infringement -- at least, in any jurisdiction of which I'm ev= en > > vaguely aware of the state of copyright law. > > > > "That would be legally considered copyright infringement!" >=20 > I was referring to stealing intellectual property, which can be a > synonym of copyright violation, depending on the country law. In my > country, for instance, computer programs are considered intellectual > property but they are also subjected to author rights, just like books > and paintings [1,2] . The term "Intellectual Property" is essentially an invention of people who wished copyright, patent, and trademark bodies of law were treated more like actual property law. Saying something is "intellectual property" sure makes it *sound* like violating the relevant law should be called "stealing", but it's still not theft under the law (unless you happen to live in some jurisdiction that treats this stuff in a very nonstandard manner -- I can't speak for all jurisdictions, since I know nothing about copyright law in Eritrea, for instance). Not only is copyright not *legally* considered theft, but it is not *practically* equivalent to theft, either. In theft, a person has a thing in his or her possession, and the thief takes it away. There is no thing in a copyright holder's possession that is taken away when copyright is infringed. The common excuse for calling it theft is reference to the copyright holder's profits being "stolen", but because those profits do not even exist yet at the time of the copyright infringement, they are not literally being "taken away". >=20 > References (in Portuguese) >=20 > [1] http://www.planalto.gov.br/ccivil_03/Leis/L9609.htm > [2] http://www.planalto.gov.br/ccivil_03/Leis/L9610.htm Alas, I do not read Portuguese. Maybe in Portugal the word for "theft" is defined differently than here, so that it applies not to property per se, but to any illegal act of acquisition; that is not a jurisdiction whose copyright laws are familiar to me. I rather doubt it, though, because a legal definition of theft that is applicable to copyright would fail to account for actual theft of actual property of naturally limited abundance. Given an example with which I am more familiar (the United States), though, I cite Dowling v. US: The infringer invades a statutorily defined province guaranteed to the copyright holder alone. But he does not assume physical control over the copyright; nor does he wholly deprive its owner of its use. Dowling v. US specfically set forth for those who wished to define bootleg recordings as "stolen property" the details for why this was not an appropriate definition, and rejected outright and in all its particulars the concept that copyright infringement is theft in any legal sense of the term. The reasoning is summed up in the above two-sentence quote from the Dowling v. US decision. The economic principle that differentiates copyright infringement from property theft is that of rivalry. A rival good is one whose use by one consumer prevents the use by another, whereas a nonrival good is one whose use by one consumer does not interfere with the use by another. Copyright infringement is illegal acquisition, by a consumer, of a nonrival good; property theft is illegal acquisition, by a consumer, of a rival good. Copyright violation does not deprive anyone else of the opportunity to acquire or use the good in question, whereas property theft *does*, accounting for the differences of legal status for acquisition between rival and nonrival goods. Thomas Jefferson, in discussions of the idea of copyright and patent law before such were even included in the US Constitution, made this distinction as well: He who receives an idea from me, receives instruction himself without lessening mine; as he who lights his taper at mine, receives light without darkening me. --=20 Chad Perrin [ original content licensed OWL: http://owl.apotheon.org ] --ew6BAiZeqk4r7MaW Content-Type: application/pgp-signature Content-Disposition: inline -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v2.0.13 (FreeBSD) iEYEARECAAYFAkrOcD0ACgkQ9mn/Pj01uKVb+wCdE8aX1Oc0mlUIuZdGx8ZbzhZO iBoAoKpet/O4hjECLxTNBhhQNd2bo48m =i5qB -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --ew6BAiZeqk4r7MaW--