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Date:      Mon, 13 May 2013 18:37:13 +0300
From:      Eugen-Andrei Gavriloaie <shiretu@gmail.com>
To:        Adrian Chadd <adrian@freebsd.org>
Cc:        freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org
Subject:   Re: Managing userland data pointers in kqueue/kevent
Message-ID:  <84DCA050-99D4-4B22-A031-35E0928709E0@gmail.com>
In-Reply-To: <CAJ-VmokBfBvdLa_Wf2EajF%2BvecVntLDaxdVeNvhAOiPp6HkjNA@mail.gmail.com>
References:  <CCE4FFC4-F846-4F81-85EE-776B753C63C6@gmail.com> <CAJ-VmokBfBvdLa_Wf2EajF%2BvecVntLDaxdVeNvhAOiPp6HkjNA@mail.gmail.com>

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Hi,

Well, Paul already asked this question like 3-4 times now. Even =
insisting on it. I will also ask it again:
If user code is responsible of tracking down the data associated with =
the signalled entity, what is the point of having user data?
Is rendered completely useless=85

Not to mention, that your suggestion with FD index is a definite no-go. =
The FD values are re-used. Especially in MT environments. Imagine one =
kqueue call taking place in thread A and another one in thread B. Both =
threads waiting for events.

When A does his magic, because of internal business rules, it decides to =
close FD number 123. It closes it and it connects somewhere else by =
opening a new one. Surprise, we MAY  get the value 123 again as a new =
socket, we put it on our index, etc. Now, thread B comes in and it has =
stale/old events for the old 123 FD. Somethings bad like EOF for the OLD =
version of FD number 123 (the one we just closed anyway). Guess what=85 =
thread B will deallocate the perfectly good thingy inside the index =
associated with 123.

And regarding the "thread happiness", that is not happiness at all IMHO=85=


Best regards,
Andrei

------
Eugen-Andrei Gavriloaie
Web: http://www.rtmpd.com

On May 13, 2013, at 6:25 PM, Adrian Chadd <adrian@freebsd.org> wrote:

> ... or you could just track the per-descriptor / per-object stuff in
> userland, and use the FD/signal as an index into the state you need.
>=20
> adding thread happiness on top of that is trivial.
>=20
> Done/done.
>=20
>=20
>=20
>=20
> Adrian
>=20
> On 13 May 2013 08:19, Eugen-Andrei Gavriloaie <shiretu@gmail.com> =
wrote:
>> Hello to all,
>>=20
>> I'm trying to reply to this thread:
>> =
http://lists.freebsd.org/pipermail/freebsd-hackers/2010-November/033565.ht=
ml
>>=20
>> I also faced this very difficult task of tracking down the user data =
registered into kq.
>> I end up having some "Tokens" instances which I never deallocate but =
always re-use them or create new ones if necessary. This tokens are used =
as user data for kq. They are keeping the actual pointers inside them, =
and the pointer itself has a reference to the Token. When the pointer =
dies, I reset the guts of the token. When the time comes to use the =
token, I have the guarantee is not the corpse of a token (never =
deallocate them, remember?) and I can see that the actual pointer was =
gone, everyone is happy. At the application shutdown, I cleanup the mess =
(the tokens). However, I just want to say that Paul has a valid point =
when he is wondering why EV_FREEWATCH was not provisioned/implemented.
>>=20
>> The moment we throw multi-threading into equation, this becomes a =
extremely hard thing to manage (close to impossible), including my =
"proven-to-work" Token trick.  It renders the user data pointer =
completely useless because in the end we need to keep an association map =
inside user space. That is forcing user space code to do a lookup before =
use, instead of straightforward use. Not to mention the fact that we =
need to perform a lock before searching it. That brings havoc on kernel =
side on 1000+ active connections (a multi-threaded streaming server for =
example).
>>=20
>> I'm pretty sure this user data pointer is also breaking a well known =
pointer management paradigm, but I just can't remember which. =
Regardless, it has all the ingredients for memory leaks and/or, the =
worst one, use of corpse pointers which are bound to crash the app. I =
agree, C/C++ is not for the faint of heart, but with little or close to =
no efforts, his EV_FREEWATCH can be put to very good use, and user space =
code not only becomes less prone to mem issues, but also cleaner.
>>=20
>> To summarise, +1 for the EV_FREEWATCH. I simply love the idea! Clean =
and very very efficient.
>>=20
>> Best regards,
>> Andrei
>>=20
>> ------
>> Eugen-Andrei Gavriloaie
>> Web: http://www.rtmpd.com
>>=20


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