From owner-svn-src-head@freebsd.org Wed Feb 20 18:03:34 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: svn-src-head@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 82CC814FB180; Wed, 20 Feb 2019 18:03:34 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from cy.schubert@cschubert.com) Received: from smtp-out-so.shaw.ca (smtp-out-so.shaw.ca [64.59.136.137]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (Client CN "Client", Issuer "CA" (not verified)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 814618BB92; Wed, 20 Feb 2019 18:03:33 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from cy.schubert@cschubert.com) Received: from spqr.komquats.com ([70.67.125.17]) by shaw.ca with ESMTPA id wWDQgOPHR82YcwWDSg0KX5; Wed, 20 Feb 2019 11:03:31 -0700 X-Authority-Analysis: v=2.3 cv=NNSrBHyg c=1 sm=1 tr=0 a=VFtTW3WuZNDh6VkGe7fA3g==:117 a=VFtTW3WuZNDh6VkGe7fA3g==:17 a=IkcTkHD0fZMA:10 a=CFTnQlWoA9kA:10 a=pGLkceISAAAA:8 a=6I5d2MoRAAAA:8 a=YxBL1-UpAAAA:8 a=XYtHlOxmKIrviYMon_oA:9 a=QEXdDO2ut3YA:10 a=IjZwj45LgO3ly-622nXo:22 a=Ia-lj3WSrqcvXOmTRaiG:22 Received: from android-68f84e02b5988183.esitwifi.local (S0106788a207e2972.gv.shawcable.net [70.66.154.233]) by spqr.komquats.com (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 0A15DB2B; Wed, 20 Feb 2019 10:03:27 -0800 (PST) Date: Wed, 20 Feb 2019 10:03:04 -0800 User-Agent: K-9 Mail for Android In-Reply-To: <1235DF70-2954-4421-9CF3-AA0538B24720@gmail.com> References: <201902192335.x1JNZu53080578@repo.freebsd.org> <20190219234328.wrmteippr6vbg2fr@mutt-hbsd> <20190220075613.GC84455@FreeBSD.org> <1235DF70-2954-4421-9CF3-AA0538B24720@gmail.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Subject: Re: svn commit: r344316 - head/sys/cddl/contrib/opensolaris/uts/common/fs/zfs To: Enji Cooper ,Alexey Dokuchaev CC: Shawn Webb , Pawel Jakub Dawidek , svn-src-head@freebsd.org, svn-src-all@freebsd.org, src-committers@freebsd.org From: Cy Schubert Message-ID: <6CE7079F-5B74-4DCF-AA38-AE2CB5175067@cschubert.com> X-CMAE-Envelope: MS4wfN0oPilJvgHZHJJSAQJ7s2qed9Mk8WWZRi/rS9d5xPwgVM3qYP6LBE1yMF1J+OST/ga4L84dKF7TS8vlf683Rahio2kyx1LrhuCS038N9KAvsNlZPfgi nWS9JY49j3AZUSbJIzHAGUaEx9gpyNM1uHY5bNO3K8IRI6ZifhA946BMsFVojzgXEWqTG6rCave++OR34aVt7mvDfcVGufi4yLg44mpMV79qcOeLCJvJdX6u fUgALiokql2rHmd1Iepjv485EvVRugxZ00Pc8utOEp/tIs8MJrcUzsBBZjVuC/2GE5BAH45yeEd19tu3aTfZt3O9YNVR9RHPUm5tXxwZPRN0tfLzfPZir+b9 qKNylUnl0T3sBQhGBOwj6AFBg07d3VGO649v3O6lv4TEDd92fis= X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 814618BB92 X-Spamd-Bar: ------ Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-6.97 / 15.00]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; REPLY(-4.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_SHORT(-0.97)[-0.970,0] X-BeenThere: svn-src-head@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: SVN commit messages for the src tree for head/-current List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 20 Feb 2019 18:03:34 -0000 On February 20, 2019 9:01:53 AM PST, Enji Cooper = wrote: > >> On Feb 19, 2019, at 23:56, Alexey Dokuchaev >wrote: >>=20 >>> On Tue, Feb 19, 2019 at 06:43:28PM -0500, Shawn Webb wrote: >>> At the risk of painting a bikeshed a lovely color of neon purple, >I'm >>> curious about if/how these types of commits get merged upstream to >>> (OpenZFS|Illumos|ZFS On Linux|where ever ZFS upstream is now|I'm >very >>> confused|is anyone else confused where upstream is?)=2E >>>=20 >>> Who is upstream? Is work like this going to remain as a downstream >>> patch to ZFS? Or is FreeBSD going to work to upstream this type of >>> work? >>=20 >> I've always felt that we should've become upstream to everyone else >> the moment we knew Oracle would eat Sun (20 April 2009), and never >> understood why it didn't happen and now, ten years later, we're >talking >> about ZFS on fucking Linux becoming our upstream=2E Something'd got >very >> wrong here and I'd like to know what and why=2E > >As others have pointed out, FreeBSD has less developer inertia than >Linux, and there are (seemingly) less developers or interested parties >in running an openindiana based stack=2E > >Also: better OS support for other general purpose >infrastructure/usecases with items like multitenancy via >containerization/CGroups2, Java, etc, and mindshare around this and >other things=2E > >The only thing really holding ZoL back in Linux is the fact that (due >to licensing) it won=E2=80=99t ever be in the Linux kernel=2E > >-Enji Exactly=2E This and the fact that our user base is considerably smaller, w= e don't have the gravitas and must settle being dictated to=2E POSIX is dea= d=2E I suppose a person could get on top of the soapbox again but =2E=2E=2E A way forward might be two pronged=2E Yes, maintain ZoF based on ZoL, illu= mos, or both, and a Linux KPI layer to allow ZoL (and anything else for tha= t matter) to be imported into ports=2E However maintaining a great shim to = the exclusion of good native support is existential=2E --=20 Pardon the typos and autocorrect, small keyboard in use=2E Cheers, Cy Schubert FreeBSD UNIX: Web: http://www=2EFreeBSD=2Eorg The need of the many outweighs the greed of the few=2E