From owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Tue Nov 30 08:22:52 2004 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 69D2816A4CE for ; Tue, 30 Nov 2004 08:22:52 +0000 (GMT) Received: from priv-edtnes51.telusplanet.net (outbound04.telus.net [199.185.220.223]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id DED7A43D5F for ; Tue, 30 Nov 2004 08:22:51 +0000 (GMT) (envelope-from cpressey@catseye.mine.nu) Received: from catseye.biscuit.boo ([154.20.76.195]) by priv-edtnes51.telusplanet.netSMTP <20041130082251.GIFU14844.priv-edtnes51.telusplanet.net@catseye.biscuit.boo> for ; Tue, 30 Nov 2004 01:22:51 -0700 Date: Tue, 30 Nov 2004 00:26:03 -0800 From: Chris Pressey To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Message-Id: <20041130002603.692153b7.cpressey@catseye.mine.nu> In-Reply-To: <1101788709.41abf62519b57@imp2-q.free.fr> References: <20041129024602.GA23324@turingmachine.mentalsiege.net> <1101748454.41ab58e61eb88@imp2-q.free.fr> <1101788709.41abf62519b57@imp2-q.free.fr> Organization: Cat's Eye Technologies X-Mailer: Sylpheed version 1.0.0beta3 (GTK+ 1.2.10; i386-portbld-freebsd4.9) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: Re: The beastie boot menu. X-BeenThere: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Non technical items related to the community List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 30 Nov 2004 08:22:52 -0000 On Tue, 30 Nov 2004 05:25:09 +0100 Rahul Siddharthan wrote: > My problem isn't that user-friendliness isn't a design goal for > FreeBSD: [...] Hmm, interesting that you should mention that. I think the basic underlying reason why FreeBSD is floundering is precisely because it doesn't have *any* clear design goals anymore. By "design goal" I don't mean "push down Giant" or "support NDIS drivers," I mean something more general; a philosophy, a vision. As the .sig (cheesy as it is) says, OpenBSD is the most secure OS; NetBSD is the most portable. These are clear, straightforward visions. But what then is FreeBSD? The same .sig calls it "the most powerful." And what does that mean? Highest performance? Most stable? Easiest to use? Most featureful? Fewest bugs? Most accessible? Most conformant to standards? Plays nicest with other OSes? Largest package system? Does anyone know? Only core is in a position to say officially, I suppose. All I can say is that until they do, I think FreeBSD will continue to flounder. Blind men versus an elephant: it's really hard to unify a volunteer effort to a common purpose when you don't really have a clear idea of what your common purpose is and/or you haven't communicated it clearly. It's a *lot* easier to contribute to something that's been well-defined. Just my 2c, -Chris