From owner-freebsd-arch@freebsd.org Fri Jan 25 19:27:12 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-arch@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0C29314BF537 for ; Fri, 25 Jan 2019 19:27:12 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from cy.schubert@cschubert.com) Received: from mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (mailman.ysv.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:1900:2254:206a::50:5]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6E8886BBDC for ; Fri, 25 Jan 2019 19:27:11 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from cy.schubert@cschubert.com) Received: by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) id 3212E14BF534; Fri, 25 Jan 2019 19:27:11 +0000 (UTC) Delivered-To: arch@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id EB45914BF533; Fri, 25 Jan 2019 19:27:10 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from cy.schubert@cschubert.com) Received: from smtp-out-so.shaw.ca (smtp-out-so.shaw.ca [64.59.136.139]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (Client CN "Client", Issuer "CA" (not verified)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 4D20F6BBD9; Fri, 25 Jan 2019 19:27:10 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from cy.schubert@cschubert.com) Received: from spqr.komquats.com ([70.67.125.17]) by shaw.ca with ESMTPA id n780gXroJ82Ycn781gblTU; Fri, 25 Jan 2019 12:27:02 -0700 X-Authority-Analysis: v=2.3 cv=NNSrBHyg c=1 sm=1 tr=0 a=VFtTW3WuZNDh6VkGe7fA3g==:117 a=VFtTW3WuZNDh6VkGe7fA3g==:17 a=IkcTkHD0fZMA:10 a=3JhidrIBZZsA:10 a=6I5d2MoRAAAA:8 a=YxBL1-UpAAAA:8 a=sV6H8bnRear5oC8ljJMA:9 a=tizv6hHn2T0SI5ax:21 a=g1RWa3qjBUJJZ3yZ:21 a=QEXdDO2ut3YA:10 a=IjZwj45LgO3ly-622nXo:22 a=Ia-lj3WSrqcvXOmTRaiG:22 Received: from android-68f84e02b5988183.esitwifi.local (S0106788a207e2972.gv.shawcable.net [70.66.154.233]) by spqr.komquats.com (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id A38F5E85; Fri, 25 Jan 2019 11:27:36 -0800 (PST) Date: Fri, 25 Jan 2019 11:26:38 -0800 User-Agent: K-9 Mail for Android In-Reply-To: <9036c9e8-ba86-6e62-e2db-4dea40ef8406@FreeBSD.org> References: <20190125165751.kpcjjncmf7j7maxd@ivaldir.net> <9036c9e8-ba86-6e62-e2db-4dea40ef8406@FreeBSD.org> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Subject: Re: Importing mksh in base To: John Baldwin , Baptiste Daroussin , freebsd-arch@freebsd.org, arch@freebsd.org From: Cy Schubert Message-ID: <75D9D651-86B1-4246-8A10-959BE3A45975@cschubert.com> X-CMAE-Envelope: MS4wfNChNyy6IKtxvH32JBrlGHFgaVz+RGOjce3b55yARktx3Q0TtI51kc1SQVR0KADw+Rv6VyAlhRPahqeoyGQCMvTPdSW90jrYPhSeoVuCba9G8NUJeRen uznzBZi+ROnHwT4UTJ9Wvov1TlXHjTnD+p8qtBhjRoISCJqRDm++BYgyzlDjL9xJVgjTK2MQrMvJWk0JFdn/xbdxqEi5/h4dW1R9p8YlnNFVkxVqqrrneAjD Pa6WNJMZYykOx0l4/yV7qSTLNkZi7+/gzlyGjpsu3Zw= X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 4D20F6BBD9 X-Spamd-Bar: ------ Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-6.99 / 15.00]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; NEURAL_HAM_SHORT(-0.99)[-0.986,0]; REPLY(-4.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000,0] X-BeenThere: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussion related to FreeBSD architecture List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 25 Jan 2019 19:27:12 -0000 On January 25, 2019 11:14:23 AM PST, John Baldwin wrote= : >On 1/25/19 11:07 AM, Baptiste Daroussin wrote: >>> As to replacing root's shell, replacing tcsh is a large POLA >violation=2E >>=20 >> It will not replace in existing installation just make it the default >in new installation I can t see how this is a POLA violation if it is >in new setup on new major version (upgrades won t be affacted) > >I'm mostly struggling to find a reason to care what is in root's >/etc/passwd >line, but aside from that, for people who use mergemaster or etcupdate, >it >will try to merge the new shell during an upgrade of an existing >system=2E >Granted, if you have an actual root password set the line will be a >conflict, but it's not strictly true to say that existing installs >wouldn't >be affected=2E >=20 >>> Maybe give users the option at install time instead=2E=20 >>=20 >> Doable, unsure it is worth it but yes we can do that if that is asked >a lot > >I think we should avoid the tendency to add new questions to the >install if=20 >we can avoid it=2E I often see this mentioned for potential POLA-type >changes >and I think there are two issues: 1) it doesn't address upgrades, and >2) we >should keep a streamlined install process as much as possible IMO=2E If >we >start piling up a bunch of extra questions during the install it will >just >make users' eyes glaze over=2E I'm willing to concede what shell root uses by default part of this thread= =2E --=20 Pardon the typos and autocorrect, small keyboard in use=2E Cheers, Cy Schubert FreeBSD UNIX: Web: http://www=2EFreeBSD=2Eorg The need of the many outweighs the greed of the few=2E