From owner-freebsd-ports@FreeBSD.ORG Fri Dec 20 14:52:15 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-ports@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [8.8.178.115]) (using TLSv1 with cipher ADH-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 2B84E575; Fri, 20 Dec 2013 14:52:15 +0000 (UTC) Received: from mail-pa0-x233.google.com (mail-pa0-x233.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:400e:c03::233]) (using TLSv1 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-RC4-SHA (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id EA33A1AB9; Fri, 20 Dec 2013 14:52:14 +0000 (UTC) Received: by mail-pa0-f51.google.com with SMTP id fa1so2734270pad.10 for ; Fri, 20 Dec 2013 06:52:14 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=message-id:date:from:reply-to:user-agent:mime-version:to:cc:subject :references:in-reply-to:content-type:content-transfer-encoding; bh=HT4CNgFHVHS9/1h6hOtvIuCDEDvxGIGaCkr90xTzI4c=; b=Jpatrhyb8By+/NhDlbqRV+iORr/Wa7iEUluOWTdh/O6WS8W2r9IpOFWctpjZ33VEhz fP5uX8BXZ28WGOfXZzpaQNKdSD4l8yBFJovGalFZC7tRfjx/AzGy1Qfcq2LIxlot0vlC c5XTgwh41MWST69mXaCO/cc/puyAWpVfVQB5vvpCyL8e3ZNzR4kVMr6TtzIL7A1yLzz0 8DQbym6u4sob+1EMVKn1qpRgejpGW8XT5qU9XqiAkyawqBW5vREY43IXTRoxbhwe/6fG KR0P7XqCui85OwwsGEkoHJzG/BEJLXxGrgvSHwY06SxtZ/fSPi71ec8ZdB+2iGh00rZl Y1gg== X-Received: by 10.66.139.8 with SMTP id qu8mr8704933pab.157.1387551133419; Fri, 20 Dec 2013 06:52:13 -0800 (PST) Received: from [192.168.1.7] (ppp59-167-128-11.static.internode.on.net. [59.167.128.11]) by mx.google.com with ESMTPSA id ki1sm15013087pbd.1.2013.12.20.06.52.10 for (version=TLSv1.2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Fri, 20 Dec 2013 06:52:12 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <52B45992.1030105@FreeBSD.org> Date: Sat, 21 Dec 2013 01:52:02 +1100 From: Kubilay Kocak User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 6.1; WOW64; rv:27.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/27.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: marino@freebsd.org Subject: Re: If ports@ list continues to be used as substitute for GNATS, I'm unsubscribing References: <201312201132.rBKBWEQT089240@mech-cluster241.men.bris.ac.uk> <52B44361.500@FreeBSD.org> <52B44926.6000005@marino.st> <52B44FA1.6050001@FreeBSD.org> <52B4531C.2000809@marino.st> In-Reply-To: <52B4531C.2000809@marino.st> X-Enigmail-Version: 1.6 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Cc: mexas@bris.ac.uk, code@apotheon.net, freebsd-ports@freebsd.org, Kubilay Kocak X-BeenThere: freebsd-ports@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.17 Precedence: list Reply-To: koobs@FreeBSD.org List-Id: Porting software to FreeBSD List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 20 Dec 2013 14:52:15 -0000 On 21/12/2013 1:24 AM, John Marino wrote: > On 12/20/2013 15:09, Kubilay Kocak wrote: >> I appreciate the distinction, and I agree with your premises. Setting a >> high standard is not in question. > > Thanks. > >> If your aim however, is to change or influence others, and you'll grant >> that not everyone can know all there is to know about the values and >> behaviours we espouse in advance, then a reply guiding (read: leading) >> those individuals in the right direction would likely prove more >> effective than what was perhaps just a symptom of frustration. > > At the beginning of the thread, I used the gcc developer list as an > actual example. If anyone posst an inappropriate topic to the list, it > may get answered, but it will always get a "this is not appropriate for > this list, please don't do it again, use the XXXX list for this next > time." I can imagine it's a slight put-off for brand new users but it > is effective. People make a mistake once, and after that they do the > right thing. Since they are publicly corrected, you can imagine they > educate dozens of people *before* they can make the same mistake. Delivery matters, more than people think, or recognize. corrected -> developed, enlightened, tutored, polished policing -> maintaining high quality It *is* possible to set assertive, clear expectations and have a positive interaction that sets the tone for the rest of a users experience. > So I'm talking about policing the list consistently. >> If you don't feel up to taking on that role, then maybe unsubscribing is >> the way to go, though I hope its not as you have a lot of value to add. > > I had to try, but I suspected this thread would go the way of NetBSD > (Much discussion, zero net effect) and so far it has. I expect this > topic to die down soon and I'll unsubscribe around new years eve, since > two weeks seems to be the ports grace period. :) > John Seek and you shall find. Confirmation bias perhaps. :)