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Date:      Sun, 10 Aug 1997 02:24:19 +0200
From:      Peter Korsten <peter@grendel.IAEhv.nl>
To:        hackers@FreeBSD.ORG
Subject:   Re: generic compiling programming language?
Message-ID:  <19970810022419.58644@grendel.IAEhv.nl>
In-Reply-To: <Pine.BSF.3.96.970809111436.5667C-100000@server.local.sunyit.edu>; from Alfred Perlstein on Sat, Aug 09, 1997 at 11:19:14AM %2B0000
References:  <Pine.BSF.3.96.970809111436.5667C-100000@server.local.sunyit.edu>

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(If anyone decides to follow-up on this, be so kind as to edit
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mailboxes.)

Alfred Perlstein shared with us:
> 
> I know C is 'portable' but it still requires some major hacking to get
> programs working on various OSes, and Java can be used/compiled almost
> everywhere, although i think it requires a graphical display (right?)
> and it is pretty slow and not a good choice for many intesive
> applications.

In essence, no computer language is tied to a specific platform.
Every computer with Basic (which is about every computer) can do
this:

	10 PRINT "Hello, world!"
	20 GOTO 20

The trouble comes, when you want something more than the standard
offers. With C, C++ and about everything before that, you can open
files, read from them and write to them. Perhaps allocate a bit of
memory, but after that it's every compiler for itself. Some languages
offers concurrency (more or less) or are excellent to fly an F-16
with, but graphics is something that remained out of the picture
so far, possibly because GUI's didn't really get into swing before
MS-Windows 3.0. (That there were Amiga's, Atari's, Macs and earlier
versions of Windows back in '85 doesn't change that.)

The fact that Java needs less hacking to be gotten to work on
another platform is because the standard includes GUI's, some sound
and network connections. At the moment (and mind that: at this
moment) that's enough to get it to work on any platform you'd wish.
But, as soon as this standard leaves things to be desired, Sun better
put those in a standard, or else the same thing will happen to Java
as has happened to about any other language: divergation.

> Why isn't there a "Java" that is not interpreted? but could be easily
> cross compiled for any machine?

Well, because that's what Sun's standard says. It remains to be
seen if this will stay so in the future, because Microsoft can be
a big influence. If MS says that Java is to be compiled into
executable code (and thus, that it runs faster on MS-platforms,
even compared to a just-in-time compiler), you can bet that the
rest will follow. They'll have to.

BTW, someone asked (not seriously), why not rewrite the whole kernel
in Java. Though hardly feasible, the idea isn't that silly as it
may sound. Java does have it's advantages. It's a simple language,
at least a heckuva lot simpler than C++, so Joe Programmer is less
likely to mess up. It does bounds checking (I want sendmail rewritten
in Java) and it's object-oriented. I suspect that a lot of Netscape
Communicator is written in Java (but that's just a hunch).

Personally, I prefer C++ over Java, because I find the simplicity
a bit stiffling. But it's definately more than just a fancy scroll
text and watch-my-pictures-light-up tool. Forget the AWT and look
at the actual language.

- Peter



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