From owner-freebsd-stable@FreeBSD.ORG Thu Jul 21 19:49:49 2005 Return-Path: X-Original-To: freebsd-stable@freebsd.org Delivered-To: freebsd-stable@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A0D6516A41F for ; Thu, 21 Jul 2005 19:49:49 +0000 (GMT) (envelope-from mike@sentex.net) Received: from smarthost1.sentex.ca (smarthost1.sentex.ca [64.7.153.18]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9657443D72 for ; Thu, 21 Jul 2005 19:49:39 +0000 (GMT) (envelope-from mike@sentex.net) Received: from pumice6.sentex.ca (pumice6.sentex.ca [64.7.153.21]) by smarthost1.sentex.ca (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j6LJn8jT064027 for ; Thu, 21 Jul 2005 15:49:08 -0400 (EDT) (envelope-from mike@sentex.net) Received: from lava.sentex.ca (pyroxene.sentex.ca [199.212.134.18]) by pumice6.sentex.ca (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j6LJnYm9060543; Thu, 21 Jul 2005 15:49:34 -0400 (EDT) (envelope-from mike@sentex.net) Received: from simian.sentex.net (simeon.sentex.ca [192.168.43.27]) by lava.sentex.ca (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j6LJnXaP030478 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NO); Thu, 21 Jul 2005 15:49:33 -0400 (EDT) (envelope-from mike@sentex.net) Message-Id: <6.2.1.2.0.20050721153750.0851fab0@64.7.153.2> X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 6.2.1.2 Date: Thu, 21 Jul 2005 15:51:13 -0400 To: Karl Denninger , freebsd-stable@freebsd.org From: Mike Tancsa In-Reply-To: <20050721192613.GA61902@FS.denninger.net> References: <200507211803.j6LI34dV005050@ferens.net> <20050721194500.W9208@fledge.watson.org> <20050721192613.GA61902@FS.denninger.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.51 on 64.7.153.18 X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.51 on 64.7.153.21 Cc: Subject: Re: Quality of FreeBSD X-BeenThere: freebsd-stable@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Production branch of FreeBSD source code List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 21 Jul 2005 19:49:49 -0000 At 03:26 PM 21/07/2005, Karl Denninger wrote: >Ok, Robert, but then here's the question.... > >How come the ATA code which was very stable in 4.x was screwed with in a >production release, breaking it, with no path backwards to the working >code? I understand your frustration, but others would argue if the changes were not made that would say (and have) "How come modern and common hardware like XXXX do not work with FreeBSD. The driver is old and unmaintained and does not support feature YYYYY." I dont see Soren's work as "screwing with production drivers" as opposed to him re-writing them to take advantage of modern hardware designs. Unfortunately along the way some things might break. They have for me, but that sometimes happens in open source (and commercial code too for that matter). ---Mike