From owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org Wed Apr 20 15:58:17 2016 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-current@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:1900:2254:206a::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 121CBB15ADC for ; Wed, 20 Apr 2016 15:58:17 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from paul@gromit.dlib.vt.edu) Received: from resqmta-ch2-10v.sys.comcast.net (resqmta-ch2-10v.sys.comcast.net [IPv6:2001:558:fe21:29:69:252:207:42]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (Client did not present a certificate) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id D90F31F54 for ; Wed, 20 Apr 2016 15:58:16 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from paul@gromit.dlib.vt.edu) Received: from resomta-ch2-19v.sys.comcast.net ([69.252.207.115]) by comcast with SMTP id suW3aQAXLpUrhsuW7a3SD0; Wed, 20 Apr 2016 15:58:15 +0000 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=comcast.net; s=q20140121; t=1461167895; bh=qaW9sGa9onnpAl8KQDRfWqdTmpubaFUMfPF+J93yA9s=; h=Received:Received:Content-Type:Mime-Version:Subject:From:Date: Message-Id:To; b=ChjmmtLDeWTEBBVQyyWuFavvfvTrC17txS89SuhP8m8aNCsMp6dC1jMDivPf00jQw Kzoogw3h1zBMurCEetA2JXxrk2bawr2sehdyGsONu0MxvLlBBoqOmhbtdqF8vXxE/w QRftTHHVYxZ9+J+HHE9Zi9c0+6TeRGpZxwcmfmqHpF5Xl1EtmUYYewkKWL/7swQA4V e/KwR+EX0VY5KG5ZbpekTyLGFbs/iFyaL999A0VFm1WrM2qBDiuzfiIeL/YR6MBf4A thH8Gdp1VZ+8Oluas4QHrnmhimimsTCCmo+ykQYTqAcNc8O/fp4r9dRGkbmQUPhvW4 xNHB4C+prlfww== Received: from [IPv6:2001:468:c80:a103:f944:bead:def6:df3b] ([IPv6:2001:468:c80:a103:f944:bead:def6:df3b]) by resomta-ch2-19v.sys.comcast.net with comcast id kfy01s00e1BqwLc01fy5mH; Wed, 20 Apr 2016 15:58:12 +0000 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 9.3 \(3124\)) Subject: Re: [CFT] packaging the base system with pkg(8) From: Paul Mather In-Reply-To: <20160420145416.GB67390@zxy.spb.ru> Date: Wed, 20 Apr 2016 11:57:47 -0400 Cc: freebsd-current@freebsd.org Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: References: <5DBC1E44-E562-4A5B-9DD9-47C1C62AFB9D@gromit.dlib.vt.edu> <20160420145416.GB67390@zxy.spb.ru> To: Slawa Olhovchenkov X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3124) X-BeenThere: freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.21 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about the use of FreeBSD-current List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 20 Apr 2016 15:58:17 -0000 On Apr 20, 2016, at 10:54 AM, Slawa Olhovchenkov wrote: >> A packaged base is just another way of describing the state of the >> system. People on mailing lists will still be able to help people >> fix their problems, but they'll just use different information to >> pinpoint the precise components affected. >=20 > How identify this systems? By 800-line lists of package versions? In my experience, troubleshooting usually proceeds from the description = of the symptoms. So, if someone says, "I just updated and Sendmail has = stopped sending e-mails," or "I just updated and I can no longer SSH = into my system," then the logical question is to ask what versions of = the packages they're running that pertain to those binaries. In other = words, you start at the symptom and work outwards from there. In my = experience, it's not necessary to have an exact inventory of a system to = be able to solve a problem with it. A tool like pkg makes it easy to know which package is associated with a = given file and also which packages that package depends upon and which = are dependencies of it. So, pkg makes it relatively painless to zoom in = or out from a given symptom (i.e., binary or library that might have = changed). I don't believe this is possible in the current FreeBSD = setup. This is a huge gain in functionality. Cheers, Paul.