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Date:      Thu, 3 Jan 2002 16:24:08 -0500 (EST)
From:      Mikhail Teterin <mi@aldan.algebra.com>
To:        petef@databits.net
Cc:        hetzels@westbend.net, jeh@FreeBSD.ORG, joseph@randomnetworks.com, lioux@FreeBSD.ORG, ports@FreeBSD.ORG, nbm@mithrandr.moria.org
Subject:   Re: Multiple packages from one port
Message-ID:  <200201032124.g03LOBf54171@aldan.algebra.com>
In-Reply-To: <20011229120106.B53652@databits.net>

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On 29 Dec, Pete Fritchman wrote:
> [ cc: trimmed]
> 
> ++ 29/12/01 11:44 -0500 - Mikhail Teterin:
> | Makes  sense.  If  only  we  weren't so  fixated  on  the  pre-built
> | packages, there'd be nothing to talk about.
> 
> Ports are about building packages.

No, ports are  about letting our users build  software locally. Packages
are simply the next step...

> I would guess  that a majority of  our users tend to  use packages...

Do you have any numbers? I don't...

> I've introduced  about 10  of my  friends to FreeBSD  in the  past few
> months,  all of  them being  fairly unix  illiterate. They  all *love*
> packages.  I can't  get them  to touch  ports --  they think  it's too
> complicated.

Perhaps, you are not explaining it to them well enough?.. Why is

	cd /usr/ports/whatever/you-want
	make install clean

any more complicated, than

	cd /cdrom/ports/packages/All
	pkg_add you-want.tgz

> | > The frontpage-<lang> ports are not  slave ports of frontpage port.
> | > They  are  slave ports  to  the  first  FrontPage Web  Admin  port
> | > (www/frontpage-ar).
> |
> | Ok, thanks. Pardon my ignorance. What I really meant to say, is they
> | should  all  be made  into  one  port  --  with options,  just  like
> | kde2-i18n (or php,  or ghostscript). Unless, of course, we  are in a
> | race to hit a certain port-number growth target :-)
>
> I agree with you -- they *should*. This would be ideal.
 
> Instead of fighting over frontpage  ports, let's brainstorm and try to
> come up with something useful to build multiple packages from one port
> -- this would be a great feature.

As I indicated before, I personally  am not very interested in packages.
The reason I started (and continue  on) this thread, is because the many
frontpage-?? ports once again underscore  a troublesome trend -- useless
ports are added to the system  _purely_ for the sake of having pre-built
packages. IMHO, bento and packages are  outside of the ports domain, and
the integrity of the ports system should not be sacrificed for them.

On  3 Jan, Neil Blakey-Milner wrote:

> However,  if you're  interested  in building  a  solution to  whatever
> problem you perceive, please start a new discussion with a new Subject
> line,  without the  References: or  In-Reply-To: headers  referring to
> this discussion.

The problem I perceive is very simple to solve. Put all the frontpage-??
ports into one with a dialog(1) based configure. After that, whoever has
a  problem with  frontpage-??  packages  not available  as  part of  the
FreeBSD  distribution  is welcome  to  follow  Neil's suggestion  quoted
above.

	-mi


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