From owner-freebsd-stable@freebsd.org Sun Aug 26 00:47:17 2018 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-stable@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 755BF109AF04; Sun, 26 Aug 2018 00:47:17 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from gurenchan@gmail.com) Received: from mail-it0-x230.google.com (mail-it0-x230.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4001:c0b::230]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (Client CN "smtp.gmail.com", Issuer "Google Internet Authority G3" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id D78338892E; Sun, 26 Aug 2018 00:47:16 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from gurenchan@gmail.com) Received: by mail-it0-x230.google.com with SMTP id t69-v6so6402791itb.4; Sat, 25 Aug 2018 17:47:16 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=3VhG/phqoT4owal3849cmtrCqcxotWaDAG0lx6WWTH4=; b=fAZ0eWepJXttmnSTiqHidreLrjegf8PumFDfMqbofoOCPrNQTKc1yiWTD4fRmuiC7t NbVOi/FxW8kG1dGV4B+hLWr2IXAGFq2jfP+3vLwXQW3WekGJeKTYOQ73SGKRA15QGQ85 bnsO+fbWt9Qn/AnPflt2p2dvzHE6o2jD6N9khj0yPLRiFqS7pF9ryzce6qtUEkaq0D5/ TU++vYo47FrlsiTTybJGcL+iB3ByGVoGzhS9jyiL6tg5jNM9vlIYgJZXXtxVqC3Sa4OX yKN6lt8/HCtXO8TXz36aFpMHA12dTiuxe5Umy9DIHuAAsyB9S68TjUEdo16USR0j1063 n5dQ== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=3VhG/phqoT4owal3849cmtrCqcxotWaDAG0lx6WWTH4=; b=NwGY8CnPgJexV9nR0TQk0XiPSYZHPXu+F8HKvWvt2gJRXbbqyzxFqInMMhNMbzj+ST tC+/mnX8PpsXfNHOWYAviZ+4+2XdyRwDG+b0pOR/fdUwJOENwL+hA8gZtZq6rZI3XSek Q5CyGRjYcddiqOJPzP3NTeG29lBBJ5IYpAWmZqSOtuY8AyujASt2UtqONV50V5JXOO/X 9IZGPdTV/sNrrAxPuRT9fJAFdivCkyPKHaW0kRkBGo8QOwKOQl8MEu5ju4Afi6JRa148 4+11H4MrBy6uc7Lzu2Ky1hApXjxmIotYc7Pqj0Mo7aFNnZ55RUEeJw0JtL6UUbCZ+2HG h4jg== X-Gm-Message-State: APzg51B7BzHwTlu0SzwQkdAczi4Vkof2E2VFB7+n/fzGaj40ymtZzCGw +YeUNUU6zzeXjxbsNX9/v1XSLW7Q+5HAcKWLU1k5SdSNLxs= X-Google-Smtp-Source: ANB0VdYBvOQE7UYs8AC2UeGJ8NGuwbNysoPbH/IFVRcY24NI9lx48ZeH1JHVv7qdU8IdhdDFBZxUx1xSeCDjl0NOG4Y= X-Received: by 2002:a24:d0d6:: with SMTP id m205-v6mr2684513itg.89.1535244436166; Sat, 25 Aug 2018 17:47:16 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <20180824215302.ivfna55jtrtc5trg@freebsd480.station> <86k1oepbdr.fsf@next.des.no> In-Reply-To: From: blubee blubeeme Date: Sun, 26 Aug 2018 08:47:04 +0800 Message-ID: Subject: Re: drm / drm2 removal in 12 To: Johannes Lundberg Cc: Ali Abdallah , FreeBSD current , Warner Losh , des@des.no, freebsd-stable@freebsd.org, mmacy@freebsd.org Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.27 X-BeenThere: freebsd-stable@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.27 Precedence: list List-Id: Production branch of FreeBSD source code List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 26 Aug 2018 00:47:17 -0000 On Sun, Aug 26, 2018 at 8:16 AM Johannes Lundberg wrote: > > > On Sun, Aug 26, 2018 at 00:25 blubee blubeeme wrote= : > >> On Sun, Aug 26, 2018 at 2:08 AM Dag-Erling Sm=C3=B8rgrav wr= ote: >> >> > blubee blubeeme writes: >> > > True on both points my tone is just a reflection of attitudes of the >> > > individuals that I am currently addressing. >> > >> > Well, congratulations on alienating absolutely everybody you have >> > interacted with on this topic. >> > >> > > Some people enjoy making contributions w/o waving a banner constantl= y >> > > wanting acknowledgement, a pat on the head and good job from everyon= e. >> > >> > The only person I see constantly craving attention and validation from >> > others here is you. >> > >> > > How far will core FreeBSD bend over backwards to accommodate these >> > > devs. >> > >> > The core team does not decide what goes into the tree or not. The >> > developers do. >> > >> > > This is the beauty of an open source project, we bring the best to t= he >> > > table, [...] >> > >> > Who exactly is =E2=80=9Cwe=E2=80=9D here? You are not a member of the= project, you do >> > not speak for the project, and after seeing how you treat our fellow >> > developers, our friends, most of us want nothing to do with you. If >> > can't live with that, I'm sure you can figure out how to install Linux= . >> > >> > DES >> > -- >> > Dag-Erling Sm=C3=B8rgrav - des@des.no >> >> >> Some on here want to attack my personality because they think that I am >> abrasive, fine but that's not the issue. >> >> Some claim that they run the code and it works wonderful for them with n= o >> issues, again that's lovely keep on running the code. >> >> Nevertheless let me restate the point that you guys are all seeming to >> miss; If you can go out and build custom kernels with custom options and >> out of mainline tree that's fine, keep doing that until you have somethi= ng >> that's production ready and as easy to install as the rest of FreeBSD >> system. >> >> The graphics stack on FreeBSD is pretty bad as it stands but all the >> documentation currently out there is about using it as it stands now. >> >> Why do you need to rip out the current graphics drivers which will break >> systems for the vast majority of silent users who will not complain and >> just leave? >> >> ---- A little background ---- >> Do you know why Samsung, Motorola, Sony, LG, Nokia, etc... never update >> their phones to the latest android version? >> >> It's because the Linux kernel is such a mess they know it's a waste of >> resources to try. You should not have to ask how or why I know this but = if >> it's unclear I was in the field. >> ----------------------------------- >> >> Now you guys who claim to only be hobbyist doing this in their free time >> expect to maintain this when those companies with all their resources >> cannot? >> >> Those 30,000 ports many of them bring bugs with them because of this >> Linuxkpi stuff. Just recently there was a user who said google earth >> doesn't work the answer was it doesn't work and that's that. >> >> They get ported and then get dropped so while the ports tree is large, i= f >> you actually try to use some of those programs they are broken, >> maintenance >> hell for the developers and confusion for the users. >> >> Johannes Lundberg I know that you are one of the main working on this >> linuxkpi stuff but anyone else is free to answer as well. >> >> Let's have an open discussion why do you need to remove the current >> graphics stack to continue with your work? > > > This has been discussed over and over on the mailing list and I don=E2=80= =99t > think anyone wants to do it over again so please feel free to search the > archives. > > You=E2=80=99re misinformed. We are not removing anything for anyone. We a= re moving > it to ports. > =E2=80=9Cpkg install drm-legacy-kmod=E2=80=9D will install those drivers = for you that were > earlier in base. I thought we have been clear about this but maybe we > haven=E2=80=99t been clear enough. > > > >> _______________________________________________ >> freebsd-current@freebsd.org mailing list >> https://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-current >> To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-current-unsubscribe@freebsd.or= g >> " >> > Have you or anyone working on this drm-legacy-kmod stuff done any testing= s of how this will affect current users? 1) Take a [test] system with the current graphics stack installed and working. 2) Apply your patches to remove the drm from base to create a port 3) update the working [test] system after applying your changes How does your changes affect a [test] system that is already up and running= ? Have any of you guys tried that? Do you have any documentation on how it'll affect users. You guys want to remove things from the current system but you come with; it works for us hobbyists. Where do users go to get steps to do all of this stuff? You've repeatedly said what you want to do sure, but have you tested it?