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Date:      Wed, 4 Nov 2020 21:49:54 +0200
From:      Konstantin Belousov <kostikbel@gmail.com>
To:        Stefan Esser <se@freebsd.org>
Cc:        Emmanuel Vadot <manu@bidouilliste.com>, src-committers <src-committers@freebsd.org>, svn-src-all <svn-src-all@freebsd.org>, svn-src-head@freebsd.org
Subject:   Re: svn commit: r367280 - head/lib/libc/gen
Message-ID:  <20201104194954.GR2654@kib.kiev.ua>
In-Reply-To: <f1e7f0b1-9616-68ce-414d-3779db33ae67@freebsd.org>
References:  <202011021848.0A2Im7Kx098921@repo.freebsd.org> <CAPjTQNGoy_%2BNc=VvbC=9oNOf_FG4oM0XNaHv%2Bq5oDsvpngSUOQ@mail.gmail.com> <338fdfbb-6fad-0e44-5df6-b5a1c38d3e4f@freebsd.org> <20201102224907.401c9200dffba42cab827b2d@bidouilliste.com> <20201102221039.GN2654@kib.kiev.ua> <f1e7f0b1-9616-68ce-414d-3779db33ae67@freebsd.org>

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On Mon, Nov 02, 2020 at 11:51:12PM +0100, Stefan Esser wrote:
> Am 02.11.20 um 23:10 schrieb Konstantin Belousov:
> > On Mon, Nov 02, 2020 at 10:49:07PM +0100, Emmanuel Vadot wrote:
> > >   I think that the first question we want to ask is : Do we want to
> > > support LOCALBASE being different than /usr/local
> > >   I honestly don't see any advantages of making it !=/usr/local/ and
> > > before we start putting a lot of new/useless(for I guess 99% of our
> > > user base) in the tree we should here why people are using /usr/pkg or
> > > whatever weird location.
> > >   If they have some good argument, then we should proceed further.
> > 
> > I would be delighted to be able to install _and use_ two independent
> > set of packages from the same base system install.  Without recursing
> > to jails, X forwarding, etc.
> 
> I understand the use case, and I agree this may be appropriate for
> a development system.
> 
> But on a production system I'd never want to have a non-constant and
> not generally applied LOCALBASE, at least not on a system that gives
> a CLI to unprivileged users. Those could build their own copy of the
> LOCALBASE tree (e.g. sym-linking all sub-trees that are to be kept
> unmodified, replacing config files that policies that restrict the
> user).
So how this makes attitude to the feature different ?  For me, dev machine
is my production box because what I do is development.  And for user that
need to run an old binary-only 32bit app which requires X libs, for instance,
it also would be a production.

> 
> And if LOCALBASE is not compiled into binaries but somehow obtained
> at run-time, there are a number of attacks I can imagine (e.g. by
> LD_PRELOAD replace the sysctl() call in libc by your own version).
If somebody can LD_PRELOAD their into your process, it makes no sense to talk
about 'security'.

> 
> > In fact I would like to use /usr/local and e.g /usr/local-i386 on amd64
> > machine.  I am fine with me building both of them in my instance of
> > poudriere.
> 
> This is a use-case for architecture dependent path definitions (which
> I have used some 30 years ago on HP-UX which supported 68k and HP-PA
> on a single file system that way). Such a feature has been discussed
> in FreeBSD multiple times over the decades ...

Ok, let replace /usr/local-i386 by /usr/local-11.4, if you so inclined.



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