From owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG Sun Feb 23 21:13:14 2014 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-current@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:1900:2254:206a::19:1]) (using TLSv1 with cipher ADH-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id E9F616A3; Sun, 23 Feb 2014 21:13:14 +0000 (UTC) Received: from mail-ob0-x22e.google.com (mail-ob0-x22e.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4003:c01::22e]) (using TLSv1 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-RC4-SHA (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 967E81665; Sun, 23 Feb 2014 21:13:14 +0000 (UTC) Received: by mail-ob0-f174.google.com with SMTP id uy5so6512496obc.33 for ; Sun, 23 Feb 2014 13:13:14 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date:message-id:subject:from:to :cc:content-type; bh=wV4/8rvo2AhW8gT4O7urAvSftuDXLjFArRwmZjg3qZ0=; b=dIq34IrYTHPJWNmSfu5gfZ4x2bj0bN73/8BVtXRwdYD+nODmnW7Jy05SPijlgGmuX/ jQ9B/YB0Mqla3XvPhYYew6z2QllO9BCiuGOuIeRnsVhXO7u3LhOZeT20IXmDGbvESxil Wp3WqjZrTqt/28obNxXgUFhCgW9Mz9r71nUPZdkd47cobFmaEvpVfiIq9en874M7XZB9 TNlgS9n97BUQ6Q9LPL57YATcrnFnISFwwHgN4n4kesldIMFdW1WwzBpjbI5qQkQMZLYd B7s5obo++ZbsIMisCy99yzlsswVrnH4Hf7GWONEQ4d0vdRJfVb122llu4kcC7I2wrFEK nBkg== MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Received: by 10.60.233.8 with SMTP id ts8mr2534118oec.76.1393189993878; Sun, 23 Feb 2014 13:13:13 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.182.78.71 with HTTP; Sun, 23 Feb 2014 13:13:13 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: <1261682866.20140224005007@serebryakov.spb.ru> References: <20140223182232.GA25967@lucius.XxX> <1261682866.20140224005007@serebryakov.spb.ru> Date: Sun, 23 Feb 2014 16:13:13 -0500 Message-ID: Subject: Re: Linux chasing (Was: libinit idea) From: Joe Nosay To: lev@freebsd.org Content-Type: text/plain; charset=KOI8-R Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.17 Cc: Bruno Lauz?? , Scot Hetzel , Freddie Cash , FreeBSD-Current , Andreas Nilsson , Lucius Rizzo X-BeenThere: freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.17 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about the use of FreeBSD-current List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 23 Feb 2014 21:13:15 -0000 On Sun, Feb 23, 2014 at 3:50 PM, Lev Serebryakov wrote: > Hello, Freddie. > You wrote 23 =C6=C5=D7=D2=C1=CC=D1 2014 =C7., 22:31:48: > > FC> The main developer for systemd is very anti-portability and > anti-!Linux. He > FC> had actively rejected patches that made his projects work on non-Linu= x > FC> systems. In order to port systemd to a non-Linux system, he wants you > to > FC> first implement every Linux feature that systemd uses. > FC> systemd is a non-starter, and not with considering. > The problem is, next (or N+2) GNOME, KDE and X.org itself will depend on > systemd, and, maybe, X.org will be discontinued at all for Wayland > (or-what-is-name-of-this-technology), which will be even more > Linux-centric. > > It is topic for other thread, but this chasing Linux in system features > (hal/udev/systemd/whatever) needed for desktop environment is painful, an= d > FreeBSD without decent modern DE will fail to attract new users :( > > -- > // Black Lion AKA Lev Serebryakov > > _______________________________________________ > freebsd-current@freebsd.org mailing list > http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-current > To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-current-unsubscribe@freebsd.org= " The convoluted hierarchy of Linux makes it a pain when working on software porting between Linux and any BSD system. There is more similarities between the BSD setup than between various Linux distributions. Take, for example, sound. It is a layer that has kernel access in FreeBSD. Even OSS has kernel level modules. In Linux there is sound, and alsa, and pulse, and bits of esound to make the system work. A bit of difference, eh? Look also at the implementation of NFS on Linux. They would have saved a lot of time doing an exact porting to Linux but that was ignored. NFSv3 is more common than NFSv4 because the latter in Linux is still in the developmental and porting stage. --Actually, it is easier to see the similarities between the NFS implementations and see the exact similarities than working with comparing sound between the systems.-- It is Linux chasing to be on an equal plane and it is the wrong way to do things. Recently CLang and GCC developers decided to forego the silliness proposed by Stallman and work together. A bad analogy no less but, it is still relevant. Why would anyone want to lock a system into a single piece or set of software unless they did not want development to continue in other areas. I, like other enthusiasts, prefer a system that is simple, stable, to the point, and easily configured. If one wants to use the idea as an alternative then by all means do so; but, do not make it a requirement, keep it as an option for those who want it.