From owner-svn-src-all@freebsd.org Tue Apr 16 15:26:58 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: svn-src-all@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5E96E1575909; Tue, 16 Apr 2019 15:26:58 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from cse.cem@gmail.com) Received: from mail-it1-f174.google.com (mail-it1-f174.google.com [209.85.166.174]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (Client CN "smtp.gmail.com", Issuer "GTS CA 1O1" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 819F66A1FD; Tue, 16 Apr 2019 15:26:57 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from cse.cem@gmail.com) Received: by mail-it1-f174.google.com with SMTP id 139so33152525ita.4; Tue, 16 Apr 2019 08:26:57 -0700 (PDT) X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:reply-to :from:date:message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=R3QHdhBE0wAXJqEX/hbhoSxwoL1vm79cNBx5w96AjVE=; b=Cve3GZMzzXlRbfSj40Nyptg5R2EnBC4HvPhPDldT+h4OM+B7VAmzDGpvNhH9//F9bA +S0etiK9iYWZcEug8Hoc10ont5c2tGoskysgvS+cHrNdvA+Znsa5OAGX8FBs52wXc8A8 ZVYIXch5BPJKuTj1SCfHbCpZSRHAZWFZVIiG5wQdxlZOv/oAapQvCYz0m3u8ipGeQrTW MK6/sKfR6uLH8vkK2kMdPHmCg97R7P7PzRx+rw8wrhtnyN2tgm9fmxhSjroQ9nYmD6Fv FjCi4WC/4ELah76oN6S2eCTqxESdb/ykfucdN98ps66FkhfwmOKwMUKS5cQ8UxsgkT24 yNng== X-Gm-Message-State: APjAAAX8HtvPHLLpR7EfvSeIbbFs3vQkfuw9ndydQuoFSOqPxare4Ebb ie+JZS93Xf3+tVVuzhd//bXLCqvQ X-Google-Smtp-Source: APXvYqz3KSusL9pulV/t81jll4NgiO3RAw1cZqG45O+UAwEMMrRlPE0q3iC4lSpRbNHdr5wdvMYGBg== X-Received: by 2002:a24:3587:: with SMTP id k129mr27842723ita.55.1555428411158; Tue, 16 Apr 2019 08:26:51 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-it1-f176.google.com (mail-it1-f176.google.com. [209.85.166.176]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id f197sm10226339itf.5.2019.04.16.08.26.50 (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Tue, 16 Apr 2019 08:26:50 -0700 (PDT) Received: by mail-it1-f176.google.com with SMTP id w15so33199612itc.0; Tue, 16 Apr 2019 08:26:50 -0700 (PDT) X-Received: by 2002:a24:f949:: with SMTP id l70mr30805365ith.116.1555428410134; Tue, 16 Apr 2019 08:26:50 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <201904151840.x3FIeaEQ009242@repo.freebsd.org> <20190416092402.4288bc90@titan.knownspace> In-Reply-To: <20190416092402.4288bc90@titan.knownspace> Reply-To: cem@freebsd.org From: Conrad Meyer Date: Tue, 16 Apr 2019 08:26:39 -0700 X-Gmail-Original-Message-ID: Message-ID: Subject: Re: svn commit: r346250 - in head: share/man/man4 share/man/man9 sys/dev/random sys/kern sys/libkern sys/sys To: Justin Hibbits Cc: src-committers , svn-src-all , svn-src-head Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 819F66A1FD X-Spamd-Bar: ------ Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-6.98 / 15.00]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; NEURAL_HAM_SHORT(-0.98)[-0.985,0]; REPLY(-4.00)[]; TAGGED_FROM(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000,0] X-BeenThere: svn-src-all@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: "SVN commit messages for the entire src tree \(except for " user" and " projects" \)" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 16 Apr 2019 15:26:58 -0000 On Tue, Apr 16, 2019 at 7:24 AM Justin Hibbits wrote: > > Hi Conrad, > ... > [Power] does use bsdinstall to install. How is entropy loaded at startup, > which causes the problem noted in github? There are a couple very early load sources. loader(8) will load early-boot entropy from /boot/entropy and pass it to the kernel as a fake module (entropy_cache_load in loader.conf(5)), similar to cpu_microcode early load. The fallback option is random(4) itself groping into the filesystem during early auto-conf (SI_SUB_RANDOM:SI_ORDER_FOURTH, IIRC) to access /boot/entropy directly. > If it's loaded before > filesystems get mounted, that could be a problem for us, because /boot > is on a different filesystem (msdosfs, to be read by petitboot). > Petitboot also does not have a way to preload modules, so all we have > at startup, until spawning init, is the kernel. Yes, that seems potentially problematic. Can the Power kernel access the non-msdosfs root filesystem? Let's follow-up offline about PPC-specific early entropy seeding. I would much prefer we figure out a way to provide early entropy to Power than disabling or crippling every early random consumer on the arch. Do you know what the Linux folks do? On Power with darn, we could probably just spin in SI_ORDER_FOURTH until we have enough darn output to seed random. Similar for x86 CI images, I guess; though they do not have the loader problem, some people have non-bsdinstall installation methods. Thanks, Conrad