From owner-freebsd-fs@freebsd.org Mon Jul 4 18:57:00 2016 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-fs@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:1900:2254:206a::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8FE35B9123C for ; Mon, 4 Jul 2016 18:57:00 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from jkh@ixsystems.com) Received: from barracuda.ixsystems.com (barracuda.ixsystems.com [12.229.62.30]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (Client CN "*.ixsystems.com", Issuer "Go Daddy Secure Certificate Authority - G2" (not verified)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 7160326C1 for ; Mon, 4 Jul 2016 18:57:00 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from jkh@ixsystems.com) X-ASG-Debug-ID: 1467658619-08ca0410fe52540001-3nHGF7 Received: from zimbra.ixsystems.com ([10.246.0.20]) by barracuda.ixsystems.com with ESMTP id jjIzBrmqsynMWHBv (version=TLSv1.2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 bits=256 verify=NO); Mon, 04 Jul 2016 11:56:59 -0700 (PDT) X-Barracuda-Envelope-From: jkh@ixsystems.com X-Barracuda-RBL-Trusted-Forwarder: 10.246.0.20 X-ASG-Whitelist: Client Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by zimbra.ixsystems.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3B324CA4281; Mon, 4 Jul 2016 11:56:59 -0700 (PDT) Received: from zimbra.ixsystems.com ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (zimbra.ixsystems.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10032) with ESMTP id IN90iGIvEJaT; Mon, 4 Jul 2016 11:56:58 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by zimbra.ixsystems.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 770F2CA142E; Mon, 4 Jul 2016 11:56:58 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at ixsystems.com Received: from zimbra.ixsystems.com ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (zimbra.ixsystems.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10026) with ESMTP id wW2gZQa8p6rk; Mon, 4 Jul 2016 11:56:58 -0700 (PDT) Received: from [172.20.0.34] (vpn.ixsystems.com [10.249.0.2]) by zimbra.ixsystems.com (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id EEF81CA0CC0; Mon, 4 Jul 2016 11:56:57 -0700 (PDT) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 9.3 \(3124\)) Subject: Re: HAST + ZFS + NFS + CARP From: Jordan Hubbard X-ASG-Orig-Subj: Re: HAST + ZFS + NFS + CARP In-Reply-To: <20160704183643.GI41276@mordor.lan> Date: Mon, 4 Jul 2016 11:56:57 -0700 Cc: Ben RUBSON , freebsd-fs@freebsd.org Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: References: <20160630153747.GB5695@mordor.lan> <63C07474-BDD5-42AA-BF4A-85A0E04D3CC2@gmail.com> <678321AB-A9F7-4890-A8C7-E20DFDC69137@gmail.com> <20160630185701.GD5695@mordor.lan> <6035AB85-8E62-4F0A-9FA8-125B31A7A387@gmail.com> <20160703192945.GE41276@mordor.lan> <20160703214723.GF41276@mordor.lan> <65906F84-CFFC-40E9-8236-56AFB6BE2DE1@ixsystems.com> <61283600-A41A-4A8A-92F9-7FAFF54DD175@ixsystems.com> <20160704183643.GI41276@mordor.lan> To: Julien Cigar X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3124) X-Barracuda-Connect: UNKNOWN[10.246.0.20] X-Barracuda-Start-Time: 1467658619 X-Barracuda-Encrypted: ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 X-Barracuda-URL: https://10.246.0.26:443/cgi-mod/mark.cgi X-Virus-Scanned: by bsmtpd at ixsystems.com X-Barracuda-BRTS-Status: 1 X-BeenThere: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Filesystems List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 04 Jul 2016 18:57:00 -0000 > On Jul 4, 2016, at 11:36 AM, Julien Cigar = wrote: >=20 > I think the discussion evolved a bit since I started this thread, the > original purpose was to build a low-cost redundant storage for a small > infrastructure, no more no less. >=20 > The context is the following: I work in a small company, partially > financed by public funds, we started small, evolved a bit to a point > that some redundancy is required for $services.=20 > Unfortunately I'm alone to take care of the infrastructure (and it's=20= > only 50% of my time) and we don't have that much money :(=20 Sure, I get that part also, but let=E2=80=99s put the entire = conversation into context: 1. You=E2=80=99re looking for a solution to provide some redundant = storage in a very specific scenario. 2. We=E2=80=99re talking on a public mailing list with a bunch of folks, = so the conversation is also naturally going to go from the specific to = the general - e.g. =E2=80=9CIs there anything of broader applicability = to be learned / used here?=E2=80=9D I=E2=80=99m speaking more to the = larger audience who is probably wondering if there=E2=80=99s a more = general solution here using the same =E2=80=9Cmoving parts=E2=80=9D. To get specific again, I am not sure I would do what you are = contemplating given your circumstances since it=E2=80=99s not the = cheapest / simplest solution. The cheapest / simplest solution would be = to create 2 small ZFS servers and simply do zfs snapshot replication = between them at periodic intervals, so you have a backup copy of the = data for maximum safety as well as a physically separate server in case = one goes down hard. Disk storage is the cheap part now, particularly if = you have data redundancy and can therefore use inexpensive disks, and = ZFS replication is certainly =E2=80=9Cgood enough=E2=80=9D for disaster = recovery. As others have said, adding additional layers will only = increase the overall fragility of the solution, and =E2=80=9Cfragile=E2=80= =9D is kind of the last thing you need when you=E2=80=99re frantically = trying to deal with a server that has gone down for what could be any = number of reasons. I, for example, use a pair of FreeNAS Minis at home to store all my = media and they work fine at minimal cost. I use one as the primary = server that talks to all of the VMWare / Plex / iTunes server = applications (and serves as a backup device for all my iDevices) and it = replicates the entire pool to another secondary server that can be = pushed into service as the primary if the first one loses a power supply = / catches fire / loses more than 1 drive at a time / etc. Since I have = a backup, I can also just use RAIDZ1 for the 4x4Tb drive configuration = on the primary and get a good storage / redundancy ratio (I can lose a = single drive without data loss but am also not wasting a lot of storage = on parity). Just my two cents. There are a lot of different ways to do this, and = like all things involving computers (especially PCs), the simplest way = is usually the best. - Jordan