From owner-svn-src-head@FreeBSD.ORG Thu Sep 23 18:00:03 2010 Return-Path: Delivered-To: svn-src-head@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1FB41106566B; Thu, 23 Sep 2010 18:00:03 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from gavin@ury.york.ac.uk) Received: from gse-mta-27.emailfiltering.com (gse-mta-27-tx.emailfiltering.com [194.116.198.158]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1DCD98FC14; Thu, 23 Sep 2010 18:00:01 +0000 (UTC) Received: from mail-gw5.york.ac.uk ([144.32.129.29]) by gse-mta-27.emailfiltering.com with emfmta (version 4.6.0.72) by TLS id 755133664 for kensmith@buffalo.edu; 31e5c2905fa20a47; Thu, 23 Sep 2010 18:59:55 +0100 Received: from ury.york.ac.uk ([144.32.108.81]:38213) by mail-gw5.york.ac.uk with esmtps (TLS1.0:RSA_AES_256_CBC_SHA1:32) (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1Oyq5J-0006Zx-TJ; Thu, 23 Sep 2010 18:59:53 +0100 Received: from gavin (helo=localhost) by ury.york.ac.uk with local-esmtp (Exim 4.72) (envelope-from ) id 1Oyq5J-0007cT-Ls; Thu, 23 Sep 2010 18:59:53 +0100 Date: Thu, 23 Sep 2010 18:59:53 +0100 (BST) From: Gavin Atkinson X-X-Sender: gavin@ury.york.ac.uk To: Ken Smith In-Reply-To: <1285253887.95760.33.camel@bauer.cse.buffalo.edu> Message-ID: References: <201009211507.o8LF7iVv097676@svn.freebsd.org> <4C9A1602.4020204@freebsd.org> <1285169017.64197.29.camel@buffy.york.ac.uk> <201009221558.27393.jhb@freebsd.org> <4C9A6EE6.5050301@freebsd.org> <20100922222441.00002f27@unknown> <1285253887.95760.33.camel@bauer.cse.buffalo.edu> User-Agent: Alpine 2.00 (LNX 1167 2008-08-23) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: Cc: Bruce Cran , src-committers@freebsd.org, John Baldwin , svn-src-all@freebsd.org, Andriy Gapon , svn-src-head@freebsd.org Subject: Re: svn commit: r212964 - head/sys/kern X-BeenThere: svn-src-head@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: SVN commit messages for the src tree for head/-current List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 23 Sep 2010 18:00:03 -0000 On Thu, 23 Sep 2010, Ken Smith wrote: > The issues talked about so far all contribute to the reason for that. > But one of the more basic gut reactions to it all is that the users > want to be interested in helping with the debugging (even if just > providing the requested info) for any sort of crash information > to be useful. And at the point we shift something from -current > to -stable the percentage of people actively interested in participating > in that sort of stuff flip. The bulk of people using -current > know it's risky and they do it out of some interest in debugging > stuff. The *bulk* of people using -stable are less interested or > flat out not interested. And have no clue what crash dumps are, > may be challenged to notice partition-getting-full issues, etc. I'm not sure I buy this argument, I'm afraid. Part of the advantage of having all this done automatically on the as-shipped release media is that end users don't have to be interested in debugging - crashinfo(8) does most of the work for them. There's no easy way to actually determine figures, but even if say only 10-15% of crashes can be diagnosed and corrected just from the output of crashinfo(8) then that's a huge win for the project as a whole. I'm guessing 10-15% is not unrealistic. I appreciate the issue about filling partitions is a valid one. Would a possible compromise be that on release media, crashinfo(8) or similar will default to only keeping the most recent coredump or similar? Given /var now defaults to 4GB, Defaulting to keeping a single core is probably acceptable. Gavin