From owner-svn-src-stable-11@freebsd.org Fri Mar 9 16:25:46 2018 Return-Path: Delivered-To: svn-src-stable-11@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 575CFF369D9; Fri, 9 Mar 2018 16:25:46 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from eric@vangyzen.net) Received: from smtp.vangyzen.net (hotblack.vangyzen.net [199.48.133.146]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id F26FA7F517; Fri, 9 Mar 2018 16:25:43 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from eric@vangyzen.net) Received: from sweettea.beer.town (unknown [76.164.8.130]) by smtp.vangyzen.net (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 6CCF156497; Fri, 9 Mar 2018 10:20:33 -0600 (CST) Subject: Re: svn commit: r330451 - in stable/11/sys: dev/iwm dev/otus dev/usb/wlan net80211 To: Warner Losh , Kyle Evans Cc: "Rodney W. Grimes" , svn-src-stable@freebsd.org, svn-src-all@freebsd.org, src-committers , svn-src-stable-11@freebsd.org References: <20180309110240.GA77718@FreeBSD.org> <201803091528.w29FSabK065005@pdx.rh.CN85.dnsmgr.net> From: Eric van Gyzen Message-ID: Date: Fri, 9 Mar 2018 10:20:32 -0600 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; FreeBSD amd64; rv:52.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/52.4.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: Content-Language: en-US Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.25 X-BeenThere: svn-src-stable-11@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.25 Precedence: list List-Id: SVN commit messages for only the 11-stable src tree List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 09 Mar 2018 16:25:46 -0000 On 03/09/2018 10:00, Warner Losh wrote: > > > On Fri, Mar 9, 2018 at 8:44 AM, Kyle Evans > wrote: > > On Fri, Mar 9, 2018 at 9:28 AM, Rodney W. Grimes > > wrote: > >> On Wed, Mar 07, 2018 at 02:53:49PM -0800, Eitan Adler wrote: > >> > On 7 March 2018 at 09:37, John Baldwin > wrote: > >> > > ... > >> > > I suspect many of these changes for iwm, etc. are all > intertwined > >> > > so I'm not sure if you can leave out individual ones. > >> > > >> > Possibly. I do have iwm working on my laptop though. I also > know of > >> > one open PR assigned to me w.r.t. a model I don't own. I'll be > >> > addressing it some time this week. > >> > >> I often have mixed feelings when I see lots of similar changes > (i.e. > >> that make up for better hardware support, esp. on a laptop) MFCed. > >> I'd rather see laptop users run -CURRENT and leave -STABLE branches > >> for very conservative (server?) users who can't/don't want to > afford > >> the risks of running -CURRENT or require ABI stability in a really > >> long run, rather than binge-merging things. :-) > >> > >> By default it should be -CURRENT all over; it's a very good thing > >> that we as a Project ourselves are doing this as part of our own > >> dogfood eating strategy. > > > > As a data point just last night a person came into #freebsd irc > > channel with a none working wireless nic on a desktop, he was > > attemtping to use a Realteak RTL8192EU on 11.1-RELEASE. > > > > Someone had already told him to try urtwn driver, which in > > -current is the right driver and supports this device. > > > > It did not work for him.  This is about when I came in to the > > discussion, and helped to confirm that -current did infact > > have support for this device, and that this supported had > > existed in -current for 16 months, and that this support > > would not be a simple grab a couple driver files and build > > it on 11.1. > > > > The commit to add this support involves 46 files, which 18 > > of are new files. > > > > My feelings are if this driver has been in -current for > > 16 months why is it NOT in -stable yet?  I know part of > > the answer "its not a simple merge".  But as a project > > this is egg on our face.  We can merge a new very complicated > > change to a our boot code, within a few months (thank you > > kevans for that work), but we can not merge back a > > device driver in 16? > > > > I had the same questions- this exact same person had hopped over to > #freebsd-wifi and I had walked through this same process, identifying > it as "not MFC-able" at this point because so many commits having been > left un-merged prior to it. I've already recently gone through the fun > of catching up on one and a half years worth of unmerged work in > stand, I'm not really prepared to do it again quite yet. > > It felt pretty bad having to tell him that his only option here was to > either hop on -CURRENT + rtwn(4) or grab a stable/11 supported NIC- > especially since stable/11 is still supposed to be supported for > another three (3!) years, and I had to leave before I could help him > walk through getting it setup on -CURRENT properly > > > one has to wonder why 12.0 is so far in the future.... My thoughts precisely.  If there is so much interesting content in head, it's time for a release. Eric