From owner-freebsd-stable@FreeBSD.ORG Sat Jun 7 21:11:49 2008 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-stable@FreeBSD.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4A7501065672 for ; Sat, 7 Jun 2008 21:11:49 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from jrhett@netconsonance.com) Received: from mail.netconsonance.com (mail.netconsonance.com [198.207.204.4]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 413958FC0C for ; Sat, 7 Jun 2008 21:11:49 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from jrhett@netconsonance.com) Received: from 4.151.178.10.in-addr.arpa (m420e36d0.tmodns.net [208.54.14.66]) (authenticated bits=0) by mail.netconsonance.com (8.14.1/8.14.1) with ESMTP id m57LBYlN061683; Sat, 7 Jun 2008 14:11:42 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jrhett@netconsonance.com) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at netconsonance.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: 0.017 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=0.017 tagged_above=-999 required=3.5 tests=[ALL_TRUSTED=-1.44, AWL=-0.160, TVD_RCVD_IP=1.617] Message-Id: <1D5A0544-5ACA-4E60-8C6F-D62E4D2CB546@netconsonance.com> From: Jo Rhett To: Mark Linimon In-Reply-To: <20080605181832.GA31773@soaustin.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed; delsp=yes Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v924) Date: Sat, 7 Jun 2008 14:11:25 -0700 References: <4846D849.2090005@FreeBSD.org> <4846E14C.709@FreeBSD.org> <48472CCF.8080101@FreeBSD.org> <4847EF62.1070709@rxsec.com> <4847F814.10409@FreeBSD.org> <4847FB1D.1050400@rxsec.com> <4847FFDE.8000209@FreeBSD.org> <48480473.3010009@rxsec.com> <484808B8.8070506@FreeBSD.org> <20080605181832.GA31773@soaustin.net> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.924) Cc: FreeBSD Stable Subject: Re: challenge: end of life for 6.2 is premature with buggy 6.3 X-BeenThere: freebsd-stable@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Production branch of FreeBSD source code List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 07 Jun 2008 21:11:49 -0000 Mark, I'm confused by this message. You direct your message to me, but quote Kris and Chris and then using those comments attack me. I think you may have my own comments confused. Finally, I haven't asked for anything you are attacking me for here. You are apparently restating what you think I said into things and attacking me for those ... or something. I'm entirely confused by this message, sorry :-( On Jun 5, 2008, at 11:18 AM, Mark Linimon wrote: > On Thu, Jun 05, 2008 at 05:39:36PM +0200, Kris Kennaway wrote: >> You seem awful hostile - do you really think that's the best way to >> represent the project you're involved with? > > When confronted with "what you are doing is wrong, but I am not going > to tell you what it is because if you cared you'd already know" (my > summary of your past postings in this thread)? Possibly not 'best' > but > 'understandable'. > >> The option provided seems like a fairly good compromise to both >> interests. Pick 6.3 (or anything the release team wishes) to support >> for a longer period of time. > > If you want FreeBSD to be supported the same as a commercial product, > and you be able to dictate the terms, then it's not going to happen > completely via volunteer effort. At some point some money is going to > have to change hands. Either you pay someone at your company to do > support, or you hire someone external. > > Then you get to dictate what is supported and for how long. > Otherwise, > all you can do is to suggest. A "consensus statement" signed off on > by one person is the former -- not the latter. > > Now to add my own frustration to the list ... > > I next note that _after_ you said you had no more time to continue > with this thread for now (and thus could not yet give us pointers to > specific failures and any corresponding PR numbers), you are still > replying to email. Since you still seem to have some time, let me > help you do a little research here. > > Checking the PRs that you have submitted that are still current, none > of the src-related ones are from anything newer than 6.0R: > > http://www.freebsd.org/cgi/query-pr-summary.cgi?originator=Jo+Rhett > > There are some resources to help you find already-submitted PRs to > reference if it will help. (The latter 2 are new, and are attempts > by the bugbusting team to flag 'well-known problem' and 'PR indicates > regression'): > > http://wiki.freebsd.org/JeremyChadwick/Commonly_reported_issues > http://people.freebsd.org/~linimon/studies/prs/well_known_prs.html > http://people.freebsd.org/~linimon/studies/prs/prs_for_tag_regression.html > > Now I'll admit the following is a less-obvious query of the > database, but > it's my attempt to show regressions that we have already flagged in > 6.3: > > http://www.freebsd.org/cgi/query-pr-summary.cgi?release=%5EFreeBSD+6.3&category=kern&text=regression > > So these 4 links should give you some quick ways to generate some PR > numbers for us. > > Finally, here are some statistics about PR count: > > rel all kern > --- --- ---- > 6.0 210 91 > 6.1 217 81 > 6.2 396 102 > 6.3 167 56 > 7.0 563 140 > > To me, this doesn't look like an overwhelming case for 6.3 being worse > off than 6.2. Yes, I'm sure there are regressions: there are in any > release. > > mcl -- Jo Rhett Net Consonance : consonant endings by net philanthropy, open source and other randomness