From owner-freebsd-questions@FreeBSD.ORG Thu Aug 6 07:43:58 2009 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 20D651065673 for ; Thu, 6 Aug 2009 07:43:58 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from stark@mapper.nl) Received: from smtp-out1.tiscali.nl (smtp-out1.tiscali.nl [195.241.79.176]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id AAF6A8FC18 for ; Thu, 6 Aug 2009 07:43:57 +0000 (UTC) Received: from [82.170.17.27] (helo=mapper.nl) by smtp-out1.tiscali.nl with esmtp (Exim) (envelope-from ) id 1MYxdk-0000hs-BS for freebsd-questions@freebsd.org; Thu, 06 Aug 2009 09:43:56 +0200 Received: from bowser ([192.168.0.1] helo=[0.0.0.0]) by mapper.nl with esmtp (Exim 4.69 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1MYxdf-000HkR-3J for freebsd-questions@freebsd.org; Thu, 06 Aug 2009 09:43:51 +0200 Message-ID: <4A7A89B3.6010206@mapper.nl> Date: Thu, 06 Aug 2009 09:43:47 +0200 From: Mark Stapper User-Agent: Thunderbird 2.0.0.22 (Windows/20090605) MIME-Version: 1.0 CC: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org References: <4A76FB32.9050601@videotron.ca> <20090803215319.8fad2441.freebsd@edvax.de> <4A798DF2.3020305@videotron.ca> <200908051651.53302.j.mckeown@ru.ac.za> <20090805203337.c6f74172.freebsd@edvax.de> In-Reply-To: X-Enigmail-Version: 0.96.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-sha1; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="------------enig9820FEF1A5519FB2B565DDCD" Subject: FreeBSD for the common man(or woman) (was: upgrade 7.2 overwrites partitions) X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 06 Aug 2009 07:43:58 -0000 This is an OpenPGP/MIME signed message (RFC 2440 and 3156) --------------enig9820FEF1A5519FB2B565DDCD Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable > > > Many people's only familiarity with computers in general will be from a= =20 > Windows centric perspective. Somehow there is a tendency to believe tha= t=20 > inserting a CD, booting, and then proceeding to click "OK" in a dialog = box a=20 > few dozen times makes them some kind of expert when they successfully g= et=20 > Windows installed. > > Coming from a Windows centric environment myself I initially found that= =20 > there was a great deal of material to be learned, and RTFM was the way = to do=20 > it. I've noticed people who come from university computer science progr= ams=20 > have a much better foundation upon which to build. Most computer users = do=20 > not fit this category, myself included. > > While this deficiency can be overcome with self study, I am also aware = that=20 > not everyone who reads documentation necessarily understands the materi= al.=20 > If too much background education is missing the documentation just rese= mbles=20 > gobbeldy-gook and is ignored, with the fall back position of "click OK = a few=20 > dozen times and the OS will take care of it for me" expected to pick up= the=20 > slack. > > I would not be where I am today in my understanding and use of FreeBSD = if =20 > not for the excellent documentation and surrounding community. I feel I= owe=20 > my success in utilizing FreeBSD to the people who took the time to writ= e=20 > this stuff down for people like me to use. It is with a great measure o= f=20 > gratitude to these people I owe my success. > > =20 > [snip]=20 > > -Mike > =20 In light of this, I would really enjoy seeing a "Ubuntu" like movement in the FreeBSD corner. What I mean is that it would be nice for my mother to install and use FreeBSD. I am not saying that a Windows user should be able to feel right at home on a box running FreeBSD, but a computer user should. The problem herein, i am afraid, lies not with FreeBSD(or any other BSD flavour), nor with it's community, but with the computer user. Most computer users see an operating system(and the application they run most) as part of a computer. How many people say "My computer is broken" when =B5$ Office doesn't star= t anymore. They don't care about which kernel they run, or which browser they use, they care about typing e-mail, chatting and watching youtube video's. (However sad it makes me that most people use less then 10% of the features/programs/potential/computing-power the computer came with, they do make sure we pay less for our components.) Even though I'd feel less "cool" or "nerdy" (which is basically the same thing ;-) ) if I'd run(or USE) the same OS as my 76 year old grandfather, it would be nice for him to be able to buy a computer for $20 less because it runs FreeBSD. To achieve this, there are two things that should be made easier: 1. Installing a basic desktop system(next to any currently installed OS) 2. Keeping the base system and ports up to date. And when I mean "easier" I mean it should be done without bothering the user unless you about to "rm -rf /" as root, so to say. Since most people never reinstall their computer, making it easier to install a basic desktop system won't help my 76 year old grandpa, but it will make it easier for unsatisfied Windows users to try FreeBSD. Besides, in making it easy to install a basic desktop system, comes the hardest part of any *nix like system: defining a basic desktop and collecting the basic/standard applications. It's hard just to pick either one Gnome, KDE or XFCE (or iceWM ;-) ) let alone mail-clients, internet browsers, IM, etc. etc. One of the advantages of using a descent operating system is the freedom of choice. However most users don't care! I am more then happy to tel anyone which e-mail client not to use (Lotus notes, outlook express, anyone else's neck hears standing up?), but I don't want to tell people they HAVE to use Thunderbird(I do tell them they SHOULD but that's different) or evolution etc. The problem is, most people don't want to make this choice either. And the circle of life continues. So basically, to make sure people will be using freeBSD (or any *nix operating system) it needs to be easy to install (So that PC-manufacturers will ship their pc's with it), a nicely filled standard desktop environment with lot's of youtube/chat/word process capabilities and "I won't bother you with it but i'm updating" functionality. Just some thoughts.. I'll get back to work now... =2E.. --------------enig9820FEF1A5519FB2B565DDCD Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name="signature.asc" Content-Description: OpenPGP digital signature Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="signature.asc" -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.9 (MingW32) Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org/ iEYEARECAAYFAkp6ibcACgkQN9xNqOOVnWAEdACglezg/Qc3El9I9DnmQykfKKAX vzIAoJCnXX6p9+YqE+zXngtmlnIpPMDh =Y00N -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --------------enig9820FEF1A5519FB2B565DDCD--