Date: Thu, 5 Jun 1997 08:47:57 +0930 (CST) From: grog@FreeBSD.ORG To: davidn@labs.usn.blaze.net.au (David Nugent) Cc: chat@FreeBSD.ORG (FreeBSD Chat) Subject: Re: Anecdote: Connecting to the Internet in Australia Message-ID: <199706042317.IAA06131@freebie.lemis.com> In-Reply-To: <199706031337.XAA00445@labs.usn.blaze.net.au> from David Nugent at "Jun 3, 97 11:37:14 pm"
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David Nugent writes:
>> Well, I don't like telcos any more than the next person, but this
>> is a really good price. So I went to the local Telstra shop to
>> ask for an application form. They told me that there was no such
>> thing: they'd sell me Internet software for $20, and I could just
>> sign up under "Windows" via an 800 number. I told them about the
>> stuff I had read on the web, and they reluctantly called somebody
>> who faxed them the form, which I filled out and they, with obvious
>> bad grace, faxed back again.
>
> Heh, this is the Telstra we all know and love.
>
> This exactly situation happens to me so often that I've come to expect
> it whenever I walk into a TBO. If it isn't something about a standard
> residential phone service I'm usually very surprised when someone
> on the desk actually knows what I'm talking about. I'm not surprised
> very often.
You might be if you go and ask about residential telephone services.
I was recently: they didn't seem to know what I was talking about
("what, you mean a telephone with a *cable*?"). Anyway, I finally got
it, but only after they sent me into a booth to listen to 15 minutes
of hold music and Telstra ads before I got a human.
> For an arganisation (and I use that word advisedly) that is supposed to
> be servicing a communications industry, their internal communications
> and staff information system is *terrible*.
Well, I wouldn't want to praise them, but so far they're way out ahead
of Deutsche Telekom. But what telco isn't?
>> believe. Anyway, they won't connect until the end of the last
>> month--to quote a Telstra person, their internal organization
>> leaves something to be desired.
>
> From the horse's mouth. Absolutely right, and I've seen this a few times
> from the inside also.
>
> Historically, I guess it isn't too surprising. Telstra ex-Telecom
> ex-PMG was evolved from a government department, after all. Internally
> the organisation suffers from the "empire building" disease, where
> possession of current information is a key strategy to achieving
> advancement, and is thus are held as a closely guarded secret. This
> is perhaps a little more cynical than it should be, but it's not far
> from the truth.
Yes, this is a general Telco failing.
>> the most obnoxious mail IDs I've heard, something like
>> <name@unpronouncablehostname.telstra.com.au>. When I suggested
>> that their mail gurus should put in a masquerade name in their
>> sendmail.cf to get rid of unpronouncablehostname (I didn't quite
>> phrase it that way :-), she told me that the problem was that they
>> were running Microsoft mail, and it wouldn't work. She also asked
>> me not to quote her, so obviously they're at least ashamed of it.
>
> Well, that's something. :-) Internally, Telstra have completely sold
> out to Microsoft and have made quite an investment (!!!) in MS
> products, with tens of thousands of pc's around Australia running
> a wide variety of versions of windows on Novell LANs. They're not
> likely to change that, and have had to make all sorts of amazing
> kludges to get a functioning mail system (I happened to be contracting
> for them when MS mail first went in as an 'upgrade' to cc-mail - this
> is under Win 3.11. What a fiasco! MS Mail's mail database certainly
> got a very thorough debugging with 15,000+ employee entries :-)).
Interesting. From what I've seen of cc:[FM]ail, even MS Mail must
have been an improvement.
>> Yup. No problems. If this thing also gave me ftp, I wouldn't even
>> need to sign up for Telstra. What an enormous back door (and what a
>> tiny front door).
>
>> -)
>
>
>> Unfortunately, I *do* need ftp, so I called up Telstra and asked them
>
> Hey, did you try to start a ppp session? I wouldn't be all that surprised
> it it worked! :-)
Yup, it worked, once I worked out that I needed to be active (the ppp
man page I have doesn't mention the fact. Thanks to Mike Smith for
pointing out this one). Unfortunately, the addresses aren't routed.
>> what was happening. It seems that their menu server is down (probably
>> runs on Microslop). Should be up later today. But it's probably
>> worth checking whether the back door remains when the server is
>> running.
>
> I can see they learned a lot about security from Microslop.
Well, it turns out that the bloke was wrong. This *is* the standard
interface. Seems that Windows 95% PPP knows how to handle this and
start up PPP correctly. It took another call to the hot line to
discover that the signup had to be done with Netscape, and that I had
to start ppp first--exactly what you mentioned above. The only
problem is that, in contrast to telnet, it's not routed.
Greg
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