From owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Tue May 6 17:22:41 2008 Return-Path: Delivered-To: hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 208641065672; Tue, 6 May 2008 17:22:41 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from rnoland@2hip.net) Received: from gizmo.2hip.net (gizmo.2hip.net [64.74.207.195]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C2A7F8FC24; Tue, 6 May 2008 17:22:40 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from rnoland@2hip.net) Received: from [192.168.166.46] ([70.168.41.2]) (authenticated bits=0) by gizmo.2hip.net (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id m46GlS38085261 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NO); Tue, 6 May 2008 12:47:29 -0400 (EDT) (envelope-from rnoland@2hip.net) From: Robert Noland To: Zaphod Beeblebrox In-Reply-To: <5f67a8c40805060941n7d2882aayea7d72d0a76cd89d@mail.gmail.com> References: <481B7ED4.3020208@mschuette.name> <20080506171525.O52391@fledge.watson.org> <5f67a8c40805060941n7d2882aayea7d72d0a76cd89d@mail.gmail.com> Content-Type: text/plain Organization: 2Hip Networks Date: Tue, 06 May 2008 12:47:05 -0400 Message-Id: <1210092425.40346.2.camel@squirrel.corp.cox.com.cox.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Evolution 2.22.1 FreeBSD GNOME Team Port Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.6 required=5.0 tests=BAYES_00 autolearn=ham version=3.1.8 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.1.8 (2007-02-13) on gizmo.2hip.net Cc: hackers@freebsd.org, Robert Watson , Martin =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Sch=FCtte?= Subject: Re: Improving Syslog X-BeenThere: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Technical Discussions relating to FreeBSD List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 06 May 2008 17:22:41 -0000 On Tue, 2008-05-06 at 12:41 -0400, Zaphod Beeblebrox wrote: > On Tue, May 6, 2008 at 12:21 PM, Robert Watson wrote: > > > > > This sounds like an exciting project -- while I recognize the concerns > > other have expressed about complexity, I think that complexity can be > > managed if done carefully. I'm not sure if you've looked at Apple's > > extended syslog, which among other things, includes a binary log file format > > making it more mechanically searched and managed, do take a look if you > > haven't. > > > ... and I'm not just saying this to be ornery, but what about test log file > formats is not mechanically searchable? Note that I'm not playing the XML > card here (I'm not an XML fan) but the only real draw of a binary format (to > me) is a small amount of innate compression (numbers and dates in binary > form) and the ability to have field separators that are not part of the > printable character set. UN*X has a strong tradition of text files that > work around these two limitations in a variety of ways --- and UN*X tools > are built with these assumptions. There's a strong set of reasons to > consider retaining text formats and continuing to improve our tools around > them. I don't think anyone has suggested replacing text with a binary format. Just providing an alternative for those who choose to use it. robert. > One way to strengthen the syslog format is to have syslog enforce a format > _and_ enforce that whatever field separator is chosen cannot be written > within a field. > _______________________________________________ > freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org mailing list > http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-hackers > To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-hackers-unsubscribe@freebsd.org"