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Date:      Sat, 31 May 2014 20:37:18 -0600
From:      Warner Losh <imp@bsdimp.com>
To:        John-Mark Gurney <jmg@funkthat.com>
Cc:        Bernd Walter <ticso@cicely7.cicely.de>, "freebsd-arm@freebsd.org" <freebsd-arm@freebsd.org>, Ian Lepore <ian@freebsd.org>, ticso@cicely.de
Subject:   Re: TRIM on SD cards
Message-ID:  <E525A3BE-8C98-41A2-A04F-3457CB0E361C@bsdimp.com>
In-Reply-To: <20140601002603.GQ43976@funkthat.com>
References:  <1401505209.20883.34.camel@revolution.hippie.lan> <20140531102305.GK26883@cicely7.cicely.de> <05005B04-1BDA-4242-946B-28D0DA069A42@bsdimp.com> <CAJ-Vmom=r9FA_HWLTjgThSZPncGw3dkCknNGCEpd=F39AJN8ww@mail.gmail.com> <C6388C10-C534-4141-B44C-1EEB29493A05@bsdimp.com> <CAJ-Vmom_v1Y1Lt2ne7CLGvnSVLT0YE=MUj7JcoHF31aWy_9pEg@mail.gmail.com> <0A74DD39-7C54-4F09-A4B9-623A9BD25E2A@bsdimp.com> <B2EEF112-2AE3-401E-84CF-3E28A7F69599@bsdimp.com> <20140531195659.GP43976@funkthat.com> <72D59B65-09FF-4272-A795-99DC94970F7D@bsdimp.com> <20140601002603.GQ43976@funkthat.com>

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On May 31, 2014, at 6:26 PM, John-Mark Gurney <jmg@funkthat.com> wrote:

> Warner Losh wrote this message on Sat, May 31, 2014 at 15:09 -0600:
>>=20
>> On May 31, 2014, at 1:56 PM, John-Mark Gurney <jmg@funkthat.com> =
wrote:
>>=20
>>> Warner Losh wrote this message on Sat, May 31, 2014 at 12:51 -0600:
>>>>=20
>>>> On May 31, 2014, at 12:44 PM, Warner Losh <imp@bsdimp.com> wrote:
>>>>=20
>>>>>=20
>>>>> On May 31, 2014, at 12:06 PM, Adrian Chadd <adrian@freebsd.org> =
wrote:
>>>>>=20
>>>>>> On 31 May 2014 10:49, Warner Losh <imp@bsdimp.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>=20
>>>>>>> On May 31, 2014, at 11:31 AM, Adrian Chadd <adrian@freebsd.org> =
wrote:
>>>>>>>=20
>>>>>>>> On 31 May 2014 09:45, Warner Losh <imp@bsdimp.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>=20
>>>>>>>>> One of the things that I did for images years ago was =
compressed tar files. There was so much variation between CF makers and =
at the time CF geometry was important to the BIOS, so we made our images =
as tar balls. We then had a makefile target that would create a =
partition on the card that was actually there, put boot blocks on it =
then extract the tarball?  I never have liked DD for creating images, =
even when LBAs ruled the day because you?d always have to grow/shrink =
the FS afterwards. The only advantage it had was it was easy? Perhaps it =
is time to go back to that model? The alternative that wouldn?t suck too =
bad would be to create variable sized images based on how much data was =
actually present and ensure there are no holes (or minimal holes) in the =
filesystem.
>>>>>>>>>=20
>>>>>>>>> Hmmm, if we know WHAT filesystem we?re dealing with, then we =
could perhaps enhance fsck and/or growfs to BIO_DELETE all the blocks =
that it knows are free, which would be a useful, data-driven approach =
that could ensure we start out with a nicely trimmed FS. Given the =
vagaries of the different kinds of TRIMs and the various translation =
layers we have, that might be the most robust.
>>>>>>>>=20
>>>>>>>> Having makefs spit this out would be rather useful.
>>>>>>>=20
>>>>>>> I?m not sure it would be. Any writes to the FS after you create =
it would invalidate the list? Far easier to have fsck do it for you any =
time you need it...
>>>>>>=20
>>>>>> Sure, but it'd be part of a larger scale image creation and =
writing
>>>>>> tool. That way you could ship images that had the sparseness bits =
in
>>>>>> them and the tool + growfs can TRIM as appropriate on the =
installing
>>>>>> media.
>>>>>=20
>>>>> Except why have an extra step when all that metadata is encoded in =
the filesystem itself?
>>>>=20
>>>> looks like fsck already has a -E flag:
>>>>=20
>>>>   -E      Clear unallocated blocks, notifying the underlying device =
that
>>>>            they are not used and that their contents may be =
discarded.  This
>>>>            is useful for filesystems which have been mounted on =
systems
>>>>            without TRIM support, or with TRIM support disabled, as =
well as
>>>>            filesystems which have been copied from one device to =
another.
>>>>=20
>>>> So maybe the answer ?it is already there? might be a better reason =
:)
>>>>=20
>>>> Bernd, can you try this on your arm box to see what it does for =
your system?
>>>=20
>>> Hmm... sounds like another useful command to run on first boot, =
though
>>> right now it's disabled by default...
>>>=20
>>> makefs doesn't support setting the flag...  I'll fix makefs, as I =
have
>>> some other minor changes sitting in my tree...
>>=20
>> Putting it in makefs is approximately useless?
>=20
> How else can you use makefs to generate a FS that will use trim if
> makefs doesn't set the _TRIM flag?  Or do you mean you can set it on
> a live system w/ tunefs?  If so, then why don't we remove the label
> option, since that too can be set by tunefs...

Doh! I thought you meant the -E option, not the -t option :)

Warner

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