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Date:      Mon, 11 Dec 2017 18:20:31 +0000
From:      Matthew Finkel <matthew.finkel@gmail.com>
To:        Poul-Henning Kamp <phk@phk.freebsd.dk>
Cc:        Yuri <yuri@rawbw.com>, freebsd security <freebsd-security@freebsd.org>, RW <rwmaillists@googlemail.com>, Igor Mozolevsky <mozolevsky@gmail.com>
Subject:   Re: http subversion URLs should be discontinued in favor of https URLs
Message-ID:  <20171211182031.jhgansyyw7xrk4il@localhost>
In-Reply-To: <24467.1512935834@critter.freebsd.dk>
References:  <5c810101-9092-7665-d623-275c15d4612b@rawbw.com> <CADWvR2j_LLEPKnSynRRmP4LG3mypdkNitwg%2B7vSh=iuJ=JU09Q@mail.gmail.com> <fd888f6b-bf16-f029-06d3-9a9b754dc676@rawbw.com> <CADWvR2jnxVwXmTA9XpZhGYnCAhFVifqqx2MvYeSeHmYEybaNnA@mail.gmail.com> <19bd6d57-4fa6-24d4-6262-37e1487d7ed6@rawbw.com> <CADWvR2gkFGY8CH5L7N67z8mfOux=Vjv8eobpK=pOpCKW3ysAkA@mail.gmail.com> <913910fb-723b-e450-8f02-4c26b3c15287@rawbw.com> <CADWvR2hR2-DPayNVOUvTxMQ=tj7YpotVzKFHGQFPoC5ZGDvnNA@mail.gmail.com> <898df78d-c0b1-9e9f-0630-2665c3939960@rawbw.com> <24467.1512935834@critter.freebsd.dk>

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On Sun, Dec 10, 2017 at 07:57:14PM +0000, Poul-Henning Kamp wrote:
> --------
> In message <898df78d-c0b1-9e9f-0630-2665c3939960@rawbw.com>, Yuri writes:
> 
> >3. The user updated the sources through Tor and got hacked.
> >
> >Where did this user go wrong, or where has he been irresponsible?
> 
> He trusted Tor?
> 
> In 2006 Steven Murdochs "Hot or Not" work in TCP timers revealed
> that a LOT of the Tor network is on a longitude compatible with a
> "Bandit of The Beltway" location.

Are you really referencing a paper from 11 years ago specifically about
a hidden service confirmation attack? This is not within Tor's threat
model. Yes, it is a real attack, and yes, this could and should be
prevented, but this says absolutely nothing about the security or
"trustworthiness" of the Tor network or the protection it provides 99%
of all users.

> 
> If you still, elleven years later, seriously belive that Tor is
> trustworthy, you shouldn't be allowed near any kind of security
> decision.

*head scratch*

Most of the relays are in Europe now, just FYI. Tor is not perfect, but
it offers by-far a better method of connecting two machines than using
the Internet alone.

> 
> -- 
> Poul-Henning Kamp       | UNIX since Zilog Zeus 3.20
> phk@FreeBSD.ORG         | TCP/IP since RFC 956
> FreeBSD committer       | BSD since 4.3-tahoe    
> Never attribute to malice what can adequately be explained by incompetence.
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